Are top Breeders and the Kennel Club lying to us?

Question

The Kennel Club it seems are continuing to lie despite the recent pedigree dogs exposed programme

http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/

And top breeders are still defending the right to linebreed

http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2006/05/inbred-thinking.html

What can we do?

Answer 1

Sibe if someone can read the newspaper they can read a pedigree.

I am not rising to the challenge on this simply because we have already gone over this matter.

If you are going to a breeder - EDUCATE yourself about the breed and you won't end up with an unhealthy animal. End of story

My puppy Beej will be here in Oct. I know the problems that my breed has not only have I looked at the parents pedigrees but I have VERIFIED the information on them.

Answer 2

Eventually all this interbreeding will result in the species dying out through extinction that is a simple biological fact. Diversity is vital for the survival of a species that is fact. My friend only ever owns crossbreeds and they hardly ever require vet treatment and have all lived to 16+ so that speaks for itself, I have a puppy and I brought it from a top show person and I have now found it has health problems, when I spoke to the breeder about them she said I do not knit the puppies they are animals and can be born with things wrong. She breeds and shows champion dogs and you would expect her to be interested that a dog she has bred has a hereditary problem however she obviously is not, I went to crufts dog show to find a reputable breeder now I wish I hadn't bothered, that TV program was brilliant as it has given a warning to prospective owners.

Answer 3

Research our own breeders.  Research their breeding practices.  Check the pedigree for all pups.

Linebreeding is risky, but not illegal.

Answer 4

My daughter is a Veterinary nurse and she is adamant that certain breeds have been ruined by genetic changes leaving the poor dogs open to disease and pain.

Answer 5

You may want to review the facts in the program, which are biased and certainly not accurate.

Before making a judgement on the wisdom of linebreeding or inbreeding, take a moment to fully understand the genetics behind that process:

http://bowlingsite.mcf.com/genetics/inbr...

Answer 6

I don't understand why you are quoting some American's point of view?

Do Americans know more about our Kennel  Club than we do?

The Kennel Club are not lying - they are attempting to give a more balanced view than was shown in that dreadful one sided sensationalist programme.

Anyone who quotes the Daily Mail as a reliable source is hardly credible.

Seems like the RSPCA is once again jumping on the bandwagon and showing their ignorance about the real world. Do they not know how much work & money the Kennel Club already put in to research & education.

Strange how the Animal Health Trust, The Pet Care Trust, The Blue Cross and the British Veterinary Association itself all support the Kennel Club.

http://www.doggenetichealth.org/support_...

Hope - you think the Kennel Club shouldn't be allowed to put their point of view up, then? If they didn't give support to veterinary organisations, I suppose that would be wrong too?

How easy it is to criticise when you are an instant expert.

Answer 7

Of course they're lying to us. Read the report from Imperial College London

http://www3.imperial.ac.uk/newsandevents...

Answer 8

the kennel club are the hitler for dog world

Answer 9

when you buy a pedigree dog the puppy will come with a bloodline certificate

ask for proof that its not inbred

if it is do not buy it.

Answer 10

Yes we are being lied to and it's disgusting. What can we do? don't buy from breeders (incl pet shops etc) until they make drastic changes. Plenty of dogs in rescue to choose from. Anwen55 the reason those organisations are supporting the KC is because they receive hefty funding from them, have a look at the online KC trust's account. btw the website you posted was only recently set up by their PR dept! - Do they think we're fools!

Answer 11

I don't know.

That's not much of a reply, but I can see no way to change the minds of those on the documentary other than by law.

They refused to countenance that what they are doing is wrong and in the dogs' worst interests and that all they are doing is breeding ugly, sick dogs.

I have no problem with 'line breeding'  per se (this is only a human/social custom, after all), but when the result gives such deformed and poorly animals - which are then deemed more 'desirable' - there can be no way to justify it.

The terrierman site you quote is US-based though, and they have completely different 'welfare' rules from here in the UK.

(I'm assuming that you're UK-based as this is the UK & Ireland board)

Answer 12

As someone who writes books about dogs, I totally agree that we should work together.  The best way to do this is to choose a pet responsibly.  

Best way is to get one from a friend whom you know and trust.

Next best is to become a member of a breed club, talk to fellow members, and when you find breeder members whom you trust, ask them if they know of a good puppy - in the meantime asking other members for their advice too.

I wouldn't buy from a breeder who has several litters at once.  They are doing this as a business - not because they love their dogs.

'My' breed are Border Terriers, and most good breeders I know won't breed from their ***** (sorry - should I have written bxxxh?) until they have commitments from people they know to take several puppies.  Then they mate their dogs, knowing the puppies will go to a good home - and they can be choosy if there are one or two puppies over to home.

Verite R

Answer 13

The KC needs to grow some b*ll*cks. Their current excuse is that if they regulate member breeders too heavily, the breeders will simply abandon them and  go native - this is total rubbish; many breeders depend on KC registry for pedigree puppy sales.

Dog welfare, and particularly genetic welfare, is something that the KC has shown little interest in until recently, but this approacjh is in the process of ruining the commercial viability and the genetic future of several breeds right now, so they will need to react to protect the breeders eventually - hopefully they'll get a move on. Those breeders who don't measure up should be made to improve their stock or get out of the show dog game.

In my view there are a few things the KC could be actively pushing as emergency measures, if they had any guts:

1) Monitoring for genetic conditions known to affect certain breeds - if a show dog displays symptoms of a widespread genetic health problem, it should not be allowed to enter a KC show, and its offspring should not be eligible for KC registration. Definitions of genetic health should be determined by an independent veterinary and scientific panel.

2) Re-writing the breed standards with the overall robust health of dogs as a priority. As an example, for many people, show-standard GSDs in the UK have reached the ridiculous point where they often have trouble standing normally and move with a very strange gait, due to the wording of the breed standard and the efforts of breeders to achieve exaggerated versions of it. This is cruel and stupid. It makes no sense for pets (particularly in later life) or working dogs to be effectively crippled by the time they're five.

3) Discouraging breeding between very close relatives (father/daughter or grandfather/granddaughter). The damage has already been done, but there's no reason why it needs to get any worse.

KC are being idiots at the moment.

Answer 14

Since this is the U.S. we don't have Kennel Club here just American Kennel Club. I really don't know what the deal is. The only thing that I will say is be careful what you Read on the Internet, it is not always the truth.  Check your facts on more that one site.

Answer 15

I don't know what the KC practices are, but I can tell how how things are here in America.

The AKC is a registry, they keep track of pedigrees and such of purebred dogs.

Conformation showing is to test how closely your breeding stock conforms to the breed standard. That is it.

It's up to the breeders (and buyers!) to dictate the overall quality of the animals. Such as by testing dogs for genetic health issues, to compete with their dogs for working titles, etc. Good breeders should do these things, and buyers should demand to see the paperwork prior to purchasing the puppy.

When I look at breeders, I expect that they:

a) Show their dogs in conformation to make sure they're up to snuff.

b) Test their dogs for genetic health problems, and not breed if such problems are present.

c) If the dog is a working breed (herding, hunting, etc), the breeder should also compete in those activities to see how their dogs measure up.

If they don't do those things, I won't buy a puppy from them.

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