Can someone prove to me with documentation of some sort that Toyota has a horsepower advantage?

Question

The only Toyota I see winning races is Kyle Busch. Are people paranoid? A lot of people say that Toyota has this giant hp advantage, and so I would expect them to qualify on the pole every race. If someone can provide something that proves that they have an hp advantage, I might believe it. Toyota is not winning almost every race like Chevy did last season, but no one complained then I don't think.

Can anyone show me proof where it says Toyota is proven to have extra horsepower, with a link, or are people using this to downplay Kyle Busch's success?

Also, if you find a link showing that Toyota doesn't have an hp advantage, that would be nice, too.

Answer 1

toyota does have extra horsepower. people r not paranoid it's not just something the fans made up. even the commentators say it all the time. I have no link, but u can look it up and i can guarantee you that toyota's biggest power is hp.

Answer 2

Like you said, why didn't we hear reports of a "penalty" placed on the Hendricks when they won nearly 50% of the Sprint Cup races last season? The only reason NASCAR is thinking about all of this is the incessant complaining from the Toyota haters, including Jack Roush. NASCAR knows how fans feel about Toyota's involvement, being a foreign manufacturer in a domestic racing series. NASCAR doesn't give a darn about complaints about Hendrick domination or Roush domination, since it wasn't a vocal or loud as the Toyota whining.

Let the teams figure it out. Hendrick got it right last year, Roush got all of his cars in the Chase in '05. It's all a cycle. Eventually Gibbs will go through a down time, and then Roush/Hendrick/Childress will return to the top. And the whining of the fans will continue.

Answer 3

Ok now what the heck.

where was the investigation on DEI a couple of years ago when Dale Jr. pulled away from the field BY HIMSELF at Daytona? He led something like 90 laps of that race. Every time there was a caution he pulled away again. If Toyotas cars have 30 extra horses, Jr must have had 100 that day.

Did I miss it? was there an investigation that I don't know about?

it's all about the lobbying, folks. the squeaky wheel gets the grease and so Rick Hendrick and Jack Roush are squeaking as loudly as possible to get the grease they want.

Answer 4

No proof whatsoever. Yes, Toyota has won 7 times in the Cup series...but all of them have been with one team, and all but one of them have been with one driver with a chip on his shoulder. The credit would mostly go to the teams and drivers, as even though the money-rich Team Red Bull has a competitive driver in Brian Vickers, MWR, Bill Davis Racing, and Hall of Fame Racing are nowhere near competitive. (The other Red Bull team has a driver that just needs more seat time.)

Answer 5

The bottom line is that Toyota designed an engine that was lighter, stronger and potentially able to produce more power than anything that the other three either are currently using or were planning to build.

I have heard in interviews, etc. that there is about 30 more HP. The other mfgr's were also given the opportunity to design and develop new engines as well.

Go Jr.>>>>

http://sports.yahoo.com/nascar/news?slug...

Answer 6

I listen to Nascar radio on sirius and they have talked about this topic multiple times...David Poole on the Morning Drive has repeated told us that there is NOT a horsepower advantage with Toyota.  They said that they think the report got out that they had an advantage when someone said something along the lines of Toyota has x amount more horsepower then the competition...they think that they were saying that its the RANGE of horsepower...the lowest horsepower for (lets say) dodge vs the highest horsepower for toyota.  So of course that somehow that gets construde. THERE IS NOT A HORSEPOWER ADVANTAGE....

Answer 7

If the horsepower issue is true, how come every week the Toyotas do not finish 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, etc.? Thirty horsepower is a tremendous advantage.

It probably seems that way becuase Kyle Busch is so dominant this year. But, did Chevrolet have 30 horsepower last year with Jeffy and Jimmie winning so many races?

After 18 race's:

Toyota 7 wins

Chevy 4 wins

Ford 3 wins

Dodge 4 wins

Looks like parity to me. And when you consider that 6 of Toyota's wins are one car and one driver, somebody's got their stuff together.

Answer 8

That's horse feathers. The #18 team simply has done their homework on this piece of c**p COT, got it figured out. Shrub and his team clicked on how he likes to drive it.

Otherwise, Toyota would finish 8 of top 10 spots each week.

Answer 9

Great DD Ice!!

Answer 10

If you do a search on the Internet there are links supporting it and links stating otherwise. Some states about a 10 to 15 Hp advantage and some say they have about a 30 over the RCR engines. Watch the races and you'll see. Pick what you want to believe.

It has been proven that NASCAR has tweaked Toyota's engines in the Nationwide series and the Truck series because they DID have a significant Hp advantage http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story...

Just from how other drivers and team owners feel they think Toyota also does in the cup series too. I read an article http://www.nascar.com/2008/news/headline... where they (NASCAR) takes the engines home  (so to speak) and tests these engines. Any public data available I have not been able to find.

Hendrick had and advantage last year because they caught on to the 7 post shaker first. http://www.nascar.com/2007/news/headline... (June 1, 2007) .....They made use of the data and translating it to make it work on the track. Teams played catch-up last year and it was late last year when other teams were catching up. Hendricks testing advantage last year is not to be compared with Toyota's Hp advantage this year. They are two different scenarios but basically just shows how NASCAR can't keep the playing field level.

When you have evidence of teams having advantages it just leaves the door open for people to throw out the idea that NASCAR shows favoritism. That's why NASCAR should loosen the "reins" and let the teams be more creative just to get the monkey off their back.

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Here is an article and  conversation with Senior Vice President and General Manager of TRD... Lee White and also Dave Blaney.

Tuesday, January 15th 2008

"Dyno tests made by NASCAR following that race already showed that the Camrys were on a par and even ahead in terms of horsepower relative to the Chevrolets that won most of the restrictor-plate events last season."

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php...

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Here is another article titled:

"It’s Official: Toyota’s Daytona Engines are Stronger than the Rest"

Friday, February 15, 2008

"NASCAR didn’t post any official numbers, but Stewart’s engine – built by Mark Cronquist, head of Joe Gibbs’ motor shop – pulled around 462 to 464 effective horsepower, according to those familiar with the results. That’s about 15 horsepower more than Earnhardt had and about 30 horsepower more than Chevy’s Kevin Harvick."

http://www.independenttribune.net/sports...

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To compare Tony Stewart's success or any other Toyota driver's success  by strictly saying Kyle is a better driver is nonsense. Tony has had wrecks and blown tires that has hindered his statistics and chances of winning. If not his statistics would be better as well as Dale Jr might even be leading the points race right now if he had not had the same bad luck.

And yes people did complain last year because Hendrick dominated so it's not just people who want to  hate Kyle Busch.

Answer 11

NASCAR hasn’t made any concessions to Toyota for this season. The talk of Toyota having 30 or 50 more HP than everyone else is just that talk. Some of the hype is from over zealous sports writers and some of it is from the other manufactures egging them on, trying to get a concession for their camp. Toyota is producing about the same peak HP numbers that they were producing last year. The main reason for the perceived Toyota dominance is the fact that during the off season Toyota did a lot of work engineering wise to understand where they needed to produce good power VS. peak power. It doesn’t really matter how much HP you can produce at 9000 RPM because the engine only stays at 9000 RPM for a shot time near the end of the straight. You would like to produce good HP numbers down in the 6500-7500 RPM range because that is where you spend most of the race which is from the center off in the turn. If you can produce good HP in that range you will be much faster, than a competitor who might be producing the same end of straight away numbers as you, but lower HP numbers in the 6500-7500 range.

Without getting specific because the teams don’t like that. All the manufactures are running in the range of 770 to 800 HP on the chassis dyno, occasionally someone will be a couple digits over 800. At any given time you can find a spread between the highest to the lowest car of 30 HP, but usually the spread is in the 8 to 15 HP range from best to worst with no single manufacture gaining an edge consistently. The sports writers and other manufactures key on the fact that Toyota might have had the best number, and that number was 30 HP greater than the worst car tested. What they don’t tell you is that the 88 car might have only been 3 HP off the Toyota number. h**l, at times this year the top five cars have all been within 7 HP of each other. Another thing to understand is that NASCAR does not Dyno cars after every race. They average about 10 tests a year unless they have a reason to take the chassis Dyno out more often.

Mark Conquest is the man to blame if you want to point the finger at the guy who came on board to explain Toyota’s issues to them. Toyota came to Cup with a very good plan and a good engineering staff, but to some extent they lacked practical knowledge. Remember prior to their entry into NASCAR Toyota was not in the game of designing high performance cast-iron, pushrod V8s. When JGR switched to Toyota, Mark was one of the first guys that the Toyota engineers called. He is the one who is most responsible for bring practical knowledge to TRD and helping them understand their power band issues. For many it’s hard to believe that one guy could be that important, but he has been. Toyota had all the right parts they just need a little catalyst to put the effort together. Even with Mark onboard Toyota is still not running away with the HP war, all he did was get them to use what they already had in the right place. Hoped that helped a bit, and please don’t believe everything you read.

Answer 12

hard to go against the "rumors"

it goes beyond the cup series..look at the nationwide toyota cars for Gibbs. 12! wins this season and this isnt one driver thats hot, its 4 diff drivers in 2 cars. one driver being a rookie in his 3rd race.

i dont think people are complaining cuz they dont like those drivers, i think its just a fans right to question Nascar b/c it does look a little too loopsided. (and its not like Nascar hasnt been caught with their hand in the cookie jar before)

Answer 13

why you worried about it morgan shepard aint gone win no way

oh yeah rockethead still sucks