Critiques??? Clue me in, please!?

Question

Has anyone on here received a critique, followed specific advice, and improved? What was the advice you followed and what results did you see in your riding?

Why do people ask for critiques and then say things like, "everything that was said is incorrect and stupid" or "nit-picky" or they get mad when they actually get spot-on good advice?

Are people really that unaware of where and how they need need to improve? I know it's not easy to hear, but why ask in the first place?

I'm genuinely curious. I've read many critiques that were accurate and the rider would have improved tremendously if they kept an open mind and actually put into motion the advice they got, yet in the end the asker's reply is ungrateful and not so nice. So why ask for the critique to start with?

The best trainer I know personally is brutal. No time to waste on niceties. If you get a compliment then you REALLY earned it. He's not there to hold your hand. He wants to make you a good rider.

Thanks!

Answer 1

I think this is an interesting question. Mostly because I've never seen much of that perspective. The circuit in which I ride depends greatly on peer critique. In collegiate riding, you are a member of a team. Some days you will practice under the instruction of the coach or the assistant coach, but often you ride with another team mate. Sometimes it's a rider from the same division and background or even a rider from a lower division. You learn what your personal expertise is and you learn how to put into practice that of your team mates. We each take turns taking notes and recording the coach's critiques of our rides, which is how we learn to become more helpful. I can't tell you how much I've learned from just watching other people in lessons, shows and clinics.

I really enjoy the constant flow of knowledge from these different perspectives and I think that one of the best things that you can do for your riding is learn to listen to others. I think what you're referring to is just an example of general immaturity. I've noticed a lot of younger people on here and a lot of people who don't take the time to think of whether they are truly contributing to the community.

However, it's always hard to tell whether the person is sincerely looking for advice or fishing for compliments. The critiques that I've responded to have always been appreciative of my advice... although I do always balance something good with something that needs work so I suppose that helps!

Answer 2

They do it because they want to highlight the good part of their riding skills, and hope that they get a compliment. I think it's stupid! If they want a compliment so bad, that they need to ask people over the Internet, they need a reality check! They ain't going to get any better by people telling them they sound like a good rider. They need to wake up, and actually earn it like the rest of us! They just think they are going to ask us where they need improvement, and hope we say they are PERFECT and don't need it! Well my motto is -There are people who dream of success, while others wake up and work hard at it!- That's what those snotty brats need to do, or they wont get anywhere! I totally agree with you!

Answer 3

Yes, I fear that a large number of posters aren't really here to learn.  I used this quote yesterday, and I think it pretty much sums things up:

"The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance -- it is the illusion of knowledge." (Daniel Boorstein)

It's pretty apparent to me that there are a few knowledgeable people in this area, spending their time to provide advice that as you said is "spot on".  And FREE!!!

Over the past 3 decades I have spent THOUSANDS of dollars and hundreds of hours of TIME (not to mention the sweat and tears, and a bit of blood too) to come by the small amount of knowledge I possess.  I consider myself lucky to have been able to do this, and that's why I like sharing what I know on various riding billboards, including this.

If I had had access to the knowledge and experience of this board when I was in the early stages of my training with horses -- WOW!!!  I can't imagine where I would be.  

I embrace my hobby knowing that no matter how much I learn, I'm only going to realize how much more I don't know.  

I've always kept and open mind, and those of us that have been around long enough have seen the entire horse industry -- from tack to training to breeding to showing -- changing on continuing basis.  We know there is no such thing as an absolute expert, we are ALL learning as we go.

I was in a clinic once with an olympic level riding/trainer who said "...most riders are incredibly arrogant about their level of skills and knowledge -- especially when they have none."

Boy has this board proved this to be true.

PS - I wish I could definitively remember who said that, but since I can't I don't want to misquote.

Answer 4

I agree with BriBri...most people asking for critiques are REALLY only looking for compliments.  They already think they are the best everrrr and just want to show off and have people boost their ego even more.

The problem is that they often aren't as good as they THINK they are, and when people try to give them good advice, they don't want to listen.  I think it's stupid not to listen to a good critique because you're basically just turning down a chance to improve.

I can't think of anything personally that anyone has told me, but if they did I'd definitely listen!

Answer 5

I'm a relative newcomer to this site, but I think what sometimes happens is that the people responding to questions have forgotten what it was like before they reached the level they are at.  I never experienced the kind of brutality I sometimes see on this site, nor did any of my three daughters.  I have had the pleasure of working with some of the most highly accomplished horsemen/women over the years.  I've also been able to watch the training of two olympic dressage contenders with world class trainers and I have not seen rudeness nor brutality...demanding yes...brutal, no.  If you have been treated brutally by your instructors, and you have accepted that treatment, that is your misfortune. It does not mean you have earned the right to do the same to the people who signed on to this site.  You may choose any brand of nonsense you wish to throw your money at out there, but if you think that it impresses anyone who has actually been around true class acts, you are fooling yourselves.  People are unaware of how they need to improve...and that includes some who are arrogantly mouthing off on this question.  Think about it.  The people on this site are not training for the olympics...they are finding their way and asking for help.  What makes any of us think that our advice is so valuable that anyone is obliged to follow it?

Answer 6

All of the trainers I know with very successful students(A - AA circuit) do NOT coddle their riders at all, they treat not only the horses like athletes but the riders as well-they're expected to push themselves as much as the trainer is pushing them. George Morris is one of the more well-known "drill seargant-esque" trainers-it's not that their mean, it's that this is a sport and if you want to improve then you need someone on your butt.

It gets on my nerves when people make up excuses-but then again, I guess there are circumstances surrounding the ride, photos, horse that we can't understand just from a simple "HAI KRITIQUE M3 K?" - I know I put up some show pictures where my horse bolted in the middle of flat class(on and internet forum relating to horses)-and I noted that, but I still took everyone's advice(mainly bring my hands up-I was trying to pull his head down because he was trying to fling it up and take off-still incorrect). I could've been  like "YAH but my horse was rly bad that day" - but I asked for a critique, they pointed out what I was doing wrong and how it was throwing everything else off-and I noted it when I rode the next day and viola! Suppleness, responsiveness all improved 10 fold.

I agree with the fishing idea, but I also think that the "average" trainer treats horseback riding more like a hobby rather than a sport-which is fine, I know that some are content to spoil and love their horses without the stress of showing - but for people who are looking to ride at the upper levels then they need to recognize the amount of work it takes and that being nice doesn't get you anywhere. After all, I want my trainer to tell me what's WRONG and help me FIX it - not just ignore all my faults.

Answer 7

I think the majority of those on here who ask for critiques are asking because they are really fishing for complements. They want to hear things like- "Oh, you're SUCH a good rider!"... And when they actually get critiques pointing out their faults they get offended. They're the ones who think they are GREAT riders too, so if you point out something that is not-so-great YOU must be the one whose wrong. I agree with you- If they don't want to hear the truth they shouldn't bother asking for it.

Answer 8

I haven't actually received a critique, since I haven't asked many questions, but I will say that I've learned quite a bit by  reading  answers from some obviously very experienced horse people.  Even though  I've been riding and owning horses for 32  years, the longer I live, the more I see I have to learn.   I ride and train for a living,  and I am still learning every day, form every horse, and from watching other riders.  IMO people are ignorant to despise answers and advice from other people, and those types will never be good riders or trainers.

PS Nice answer, Sagacious!

Answer 9

I just started taking lessons from a trainer who competed on the A and AA curcuit. She's very tough and gives out complements sparingly. I appreciate this. I'm PAYING her to help me improve, not to give me complements, etc. If I'm not improving I shouldn't be wasting money on lessons.

I like to read the harsh, realistic critiques some of you give. I try to apply the suggestions to my own riding to see if I can get better in any way. I appreciate it, because an hour a week is truely not enough time with my own trainer, but it is as much as I can afford.