Crosswinds: Cessna 172 Pilots?

Question

I know Aleron in the wind, opposite rudder, but I don't find it easy to land

How do you cope with crosswinds?

Answer 1

I guess you've noticed that the closer you get to the runway (ground effect) the harder it gets to control.It's not taught, but I have found that it easier to land without flaps in my 172 in a brisk crosswind

Answer 2

Indeed, crosswind landings are tough!  Keep practicing with an instructor.  Just remember the "aileron into the wind..." is great stuff.  Simply put, you need to do whatever it takes to stay on the center line.

Keep working on it!!

Answer 3

If you apply  Ben Dere Dun Dat technique, you will quickly master x wind landings, he has told you tried and true advice.

Answer 4

You've been learning to coordinate the controls in turns.  Now you have to learn to uncoordinate them for crosswind landings.

Pitch - maintain desired airspeed

Aileron - control drift to stay on the centerline

Rudder - keep the aircraft aligned parallel to the runway

They're all controlled separately for this phase of flight and you're going to have to get used to thinking about all of them separately, but at the same time.   Relax.  It comes to you after a while.  

While you're high experiment with the rudder and aileron one at a time while you hold the other steady.  That will help you see what's happening and give you some time to get used to it as you approach the runway.  When you get practiced at crosswinds you'll be able to wait until you're close to the runway before you cross the controls.  But for now it will help if you practice and experiment as soon as you turn final.

By the way, the rudder on a Hawk is pretty small, but when you get down into ground effect you can expect it to become more effective.  If you don't expect it you'll be dancing on the pedals and wondering where the alternating wind gusts are coming from.  They're coming from your feet.

Answer 5

A great way for small planes to manage crosswinds is with the side slip.  Like you said, aileron into the wind and opposite rudder.  The trick is to use the aileron to the point where you are tracking straight (like a crab), then apply just enough rudder to align the nose of the plane with the center line.  You can hold the plane like that all the way through touch down.  The upwind wheel will touch first, then bring out the rudder as the nose comes down (so you don't land with a sideways nosewheel), but increase the aileron deflection and hold it as you roll.

Answer 6

It takes a good instructor, then practice, practice, practice.

When I'm teaching students that are having problems with crosswinds, I often use the following technique: I have them get right down close to the runway, maybe a few feet above, and level off. I don't actually let them land, but have them slow-fly down the runway, keeping the centerline between the wheels, first by just crabbing into the wind. After they can do that easily, I repeat the procedure by having the student fly the runway wing-down with opposite rudder to track straight, again without touching down.  When they can do that while keeping the centerline between the mains and maintaining a steady altitude, then we practice actual landings. It's just a matter of doing the previous exercise, then gently reducing power to ease yourself down to a landing, like you're doing a soft-field landing.  The only difference is that once you're down, the ailerons go hard-over into the wind.

While practicing all the above, it's helpful to have a long runway so you can "drag the runway" for 30 seconds or so at a time before climbing out and going around to do it again. Until you get the technique down, there's no reason to shoot for the numbers when landing; just try to touch down within the first 1/3 of the runway. When you can do crosswind landings smoothly, then work on getting it down between the numbers and the touchdown zone (first 1,000 feet), and when you can do that, combine it with a short-field landing, putting it right on the numbers.

Also, if it is gusty, try landing with less than full flaps. When you get fairly good at setting down in a crosswind, try balancing on the upwind wheel while holding the nosewheel and downwind wheel off the runway as long as you can. This will teach you just how much aileron and rudder control you have and when they are no longer effective.

One more thing, when you're landing, your eyes should be focused well down the runway, not right in front of you. Even try looking at the departure end. This will help in two ways: your peripheral vision will pick up clues on height above the runway and you will see if you are drifting left or right much easier. Last thing, don't look over the center of the nose (a common student mistake), look directly in front of you, right down the line of the control yoke. You will land much straighter. Guaranteed. Any side loads imposed during landing are very hard on the tires, wheel bearings and landing gear.

Another neat trick to help you detect drift and keep the nose pointed straight is to put a large dot on the windshield with a china marker,  directly in line with the yoke and at a height that coincides with a point about halfway down the runway when sitting on the ground ready for takeoff. When you flare, this point should be about even with the opposite end of the runway, and your eyes will be looking right where they should be. You should be able to pick up the slightest hint of drift very easily.

I hope this helps. Practice, practice, practice.

Answer 7

Practice flying that way directly over straight features (like railroad tracks) on the ground.

Answer 8

If you like this method, you might want to show this to your instructor as an idea.

Here's the catch:  to master crosswind landings, you have to master the individual pieces.  This means not worrying about the landing at first.  The first step is to master drift control on final.  I'd start by flying an extended final approach (traffic permitting) and holding the crab angle in to stay on that extended centerline.  Then go around.  Easy enough?  Ok, now let's try the same thing, but use the cross-control method on final approach to keep the nose pointed down the runway.  Then go around.

Here's the next drill once that's mastered.  When I was an instructor, I would take a student up on a windy day, assuming it wasn't too gusty.  I would find the longest crosswind runway I could find and work it out with the tower to clear us for the option on that runway.  I usually used a 10,000 foot long runway.

I (the instructor) took control of the throttle and told the student that his only task was to hold the appropriate approach speed, keep the nose lined up with the runway (rudder), and keep the airplane over the centerline (aileron).  We flew the final approach just like we had previously practiced, except I adjusted the throttle to keep the airplane in or near ground effect down a good portion of the runway.  We would just fly like that for about 6,000-7,000 feet of the runway before initiating a go-around.  We would practice that for 3 or 4 passes over the runway.  That allowed the student to see all of the elements of a crosswind landing without actually worrying about the landing itself.

Once the student was comfortable with that, we would do the same thing, but once we were in ground effect, I would tell him to keep on holding the approach speed and heading/drift control as I slowly bled off the throttle.  The upwind wheel would touch the ground... KEEP HOLDING the correction!  Then the downwind wheel (keep that correction in!!!).  Then the nosewheel settled to the ground.  Follow through on the ailerons, and you've got a perfect crosswind landing!

After 1 or 2 more approaches like that, I would hand the throttle back over to the student to put all of the pieces together.  It usually resulted in a mastery of crosswind landings in one lesson!