Do REAL karate places still exist in America?

Question

I'm talking the kind where they fight you the first day, where they spar without wearing 10 tons of foam, where they kick your @ss when you take a black belt test. If you ask me, that's the only way to learn how to fight, but can you even find that anymore? Or have legal issues successfully done away with such things completely? Have any thoughts?

Thanks.

Answer 1

they exist, but you will never hear about them unless you seek them out because they will never be successful in today's watered down mcdojo mentality. People want to say they know karate without having to actually endure the process of learning it, so the traditional instructors are relegated to teaching in their garages or small store front buildings where they can barely pay the rent.  And yes, the legal issues and fear of lawsuits have played a major role in the current state of "karate" or "krotty"...

Answer 2

Great question, i learned my battojutsu from a friends father in their basement and backyard, its all about asking around, you have to know where to look, i found out on accident when i went to his house and saw his dads katana on the wall and i asked him about it.  You may be able to ask an instructor about private lessons, thats what i did.

Answer 3

I was involved in shotokan for several years reached 2nd dan level must have missed the meditation classes and we sparred bare knuckles hard body contact but that was before foam rubber.

KYOKUSHINKAI was formed out of old school shoto kan as that is where OYAMA recieved a lot of his training besides goju ryu .It uses a mixture of shoto kan and goju kata plus some he created himself.

Law suits and the pursuit of the quick buck and sport glory has tended to steer martial arts in the wrong direction..

Most of us early practioners were trained by ex japanese military and discipline was sometimes severe for those who were "just trying it out" or lacked spirit.

Paying your fees learning your technique and kata  and showing up to train wasnt enough you had to earn your black belt with blood sweat and tears .The real *** kicking started the minute you got a brown belt now you had to prove yourself mentally and physically worthy of a black belt test.Physical toughness was considered less than mental toughness

pride without arrogance

strength without brutality

courage in the face of fear.

Search around you may find one still.

Answer 4

I am sure that REAL martial arts schools exist all over America. This isn't the 60's anymore.

You said "where they fight you the first day" & "where they kick your @ss when you take a black belt test. If you ask me, that's the only way to learn how to fight"

You already have your own vision of what karate should be so why even ask if REAl karate places still exist? Your version of "real" is the only one you will accept so go find school that does what YOU want but don't be so arrogant as to define REAL KARATE in America.  

Answer 5

i doubt it because if they do in now they would get sued.

Answer 6

   Sadly, part of your question is one of the reasons - legality.  People do not want to be sued, and if a student is hurt in your school, the school can be legally sued.  That is one part.  However, the main reason is that people do not live in feudal China where fighting skills meant survival.  We live in a land of laws, and in most cases, if someone threatens to physically harm you, you can rely on the law of the land to prevent that...in most cases.  There is still the street where hoodlums have no respect for the outcome of their attacks on citizens.  So, you have three choices - avoid those situations, study martial arts anywhere a school is located, study genuine martial arts that will make you capable of defending yourself against any and all street attacks.  Now, the question, of course, is, where do you find the kind of school where the training will actually make you capable of defending yourself?

   In this country, most martial arts schools are for profit only, and they are run as a business to make money.  They sell belts and certificates that look good on the walls, and they pray that their students never have to try and use the ineffective material that they have been taught, because those students, for the most part, would become statistics if a street smart hooligan attacked them.  So, the search for a legitimate school will not be easy.  I have often said that eighty-five percent of the schools out there are businesses, and what they teach will not make you capable of defending yourself.  You will not find a school that is legitimate and effective right under your nose.  You will have to search.  The old Chinese saying is that the teacher does not come to the student, the student comes to the teacher.

   If you want to train at home, you can go to www.briangray.com and order the Shao Lin San Kung Fu Temple Curriculum DVD Series.  There is enough legitimate and traditional material on that set of educational dvds to keep you busy for at least five years just learning it. And there is the Iron Palm book series available at www.ultimateironpalm.com in case you want to add to your martial arts knowledge.

   I hope this has been of some help to you.

Answer 7

Ah, if you look at Okinawan tradition, that is not the way they trained.  You do have a point about the 10 tons of foam, but in Okinawa they ensured that you could step into the ring (or beach, or lei tai, wherever) without getting killed.

Also little good does a martial art do you if you are physically injured.  If you want to learn Karate the way you want it, just take up Kyokshin;

http://home.kyokushinkarate.com/

In Kyokshin everything is bare fisted, and sparring starts from day one.  Regarding the legal issues, you have to sign a contract that basically says you know what you're in for, blah, blah, blah.  If you are looking for an @ss kicking, believe me, a Kyokshin Karate stylist will be more than glad to oblige you.  Kyokshin Karate, the training, is done exactly how you want it, but you are not allowed to hit people in the face, only the torso where little injury can be incured.  The idea is, inflicting pain without inflicting injury, that way on the street you have no fear of pain.  That is the Kyokshin mentality.

.................

good luck.....

Be certain that you don't get served up by a Shotokai Kan stylist.  Their pursuit of Karate, is strictly meditative.

but whoever heard of meditation ever teaching anyone how to fight right?

peace.

P.S.

Frankly I don't know why I directed you to Kyokshin; in the world of east Asian martial arts Kata forms have proven themselves time and again, of course I know you won't listen to any of my arguments, so, for Karmic reasons, I directed you to Kyokshin.

Good luck with it; I say "good luck," because, even though Kyokshin Karate is bare fisted, they have very little tolerance for malicious types who like to hit people.  Word of warning, if you're that type; behave with dishonor and the Kyokshinkai school WILL throw you out, but not before beating your @ss first to teach you a lesson in humility and manners.  Personally, I disagree with their methods, but I respect them because at least they're honorable.

Answer 8

The ones you don't hear about are usually the good ones.