Do hydrogen car conversion kits really work?

Question

and if so what is a good one to get?

Answer 1

Anything to do with hydrogen is not for shade tree mechanics. Hydrogen leaks through almost anything. It is the most explosive gas there is .

Answer 2

Assuming you are talking about the kits or plans from places like www agua-luna com or water 4 gas or from any number of venders let me tell you it won’t and can’t work.

Assuming your engine is in perfect tune, you get about 20%-to 37% the energy you put into it back as work, you lose about 7% to friction and the rest is lost in the cooling system and exhaust. Now assuming your alternator is 55% efficient, and let do the math.

Gasoline has 18,000 BTUs per pound.

So now we have 18,000 BTUs to play with, assuming we have a very efficient engine we start with 18,000 times your engine efficiency (18000 x .37) we now have 6660 BTUs to do all the work, this is drive the car turn the alternator etc.

Now, if we use ALL that power to drive the alternator and our alternator that is 55% efficient our 6660 now becomes 3663 BTU. (6660 X .55) So to break EVEN that 3663 BTU must produce 18,000 BTU of hydrogen, and to increase your fuel mileage it MUST make more.

I know they told you the alternator is wasting electricity, it isn’t, when you don’t need as much electricity your alternator doesn’t put it out and thus doesn’t use as much power from the engine. But there is NO way for 3663 BTUs to make 18000 BTU if it could you would be making more power then you use.

Now agua-luna also says to use lye and aluminum and water to make hydrogen. I want you to think about this Lye and water is very a corrosive to aluminum, and yes it will make hydrogen, but as it bubbles up you not only get hydrogen, you also get an aerosol that contains lye and water so it will corrode  aluminum heads and who knows what its going to do to the seals. So you might ruin your engine, and don't even think about breathing this stuff, it can kill you.

And think of the power it took to make the aluminum in the first place, you’d be better of energy wise to recycle the aluminum then using it for fuel.

http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/ch...

It just a con to separate you from you money.

EDIT

Matthew B.

No my science isn’t wrong; I used BTU’s on purpose. Any fuel only has so much energy in it; most fuels are rated in BTUs. The numbers I used are readily available from many sources and if you wish I can post a link to them.

Gasoline has only so much potential heat to be used for work, 18,000 BTUs per pound, we already know how efficient an internal combustion engine is, 37% at best of all the energy consumed is used for work. We know how much is lost to friction 7% and the rest goes into the cooling system or the exhaust. By used only BTUs I could keep all the numbers in the same units.

So if only 37% of the heat is used for work, it doesn’t matter if I convert to kilowatts then HP first then back to BTUs or not. There is no need to estimate, I know how many BTUs at best are transferred, because we already know from research how much of each unit of energy is used.

“I don't know how much it needs but I believe it is ridiculous to assume that half the engine's output goes towards turning the powering the alternator.”

I didn’t say it took half the engine’s output to power and alternator, I said you lose half of the power you put into an alternator, a big difference. Even if an alternator was 90% efficient you are still losing power. Notice I didn’t even go into the energy need to crack water into hydrogen and oxygen. Now in order of this device to work, that is increase your fuel mileage, you have to make more BTU’s of fuel as you consume there isn’t a device out there that can do that.

If I didn’t care about other’s I wouldn’t take the time to post at all, and if you wish go ahead and try this device and any other device you wish, just know this device has been around since the 1970’s and it’s been tested many, many times, and it failed every time. So not only does the math not work out, if it did it would violate the laws of thermodynamics, but it’s been tested in the real world many times and it failed.

Also just one last thing your link take you to a web site that want to sell you a two books for only $97, and I noticed that in your post you said nothing to show where my math was wrong or my assumptions were wrong. Like I said I can point to tons of research you point to a web site that want to sell you something.

Answer 3

I definitely believe the conversion kits do help and we should give them a chance before allowing our egos to get involved and put them down for personal gratification. It's human nature to want to be right about something for the sake of stealing the spotlight, it happens to me too sometimes.

It seems the previous writer really wanted that, so his mind allowed him to forget whether his science made sense or not.

I briefly read the chapter on the otto cycle (internal combustion engine) in my thermodynamics book and it does only talk about heat for that section without talking about engine output. So maybe that threw him off.

Heat is used to create work, therefore BTU's get transfered into kilowatts and then horsepower. That should be done before estimating how much work is needed to power an alternator. I don't know how much it needs but I believe it is ridiculous to assume that half the engine's output goes towards turning the powering the alternator. When I last held an alternator in my hand, I was able to turn the pulley without much difficulty. The engines biggest job by far is to move the car and from that you can guess how much work is needed to make the alternator do it's job.

Although when you boost another car (requiring more electrical energy form your battery), you'll notice that the alternator works harder as you can hear it. Therefore the kits probably do the same to the alternator.

It's funny that people assume that people who put  their time and effort to writing a detailed message along with a sincere will to help are scammers. Even if it doesn't work I doubt that they are his intentions. Unless he is a psychopath and really doesn't care about others. I really doubt that all the people who create websites to help people save on gas mileage are a bunch of psychopaths.

Yes there are bad people out there but I believe that those who are really out there to take your money away from you are those who have so much much of it, I mean tons of it. That much money corrupts people unless they are already enlightened in some way, and they just want more of and want to make sure they keep getting it. Those type of people are usually owners of banks, oil companies and more. Although because they have so much power they can have an influence in keeping things their way. But less in this time as more people are becoming aware that we need a change and more people are communicating through the internet about their ideas of helping the environment. As more of this happens you'll see that car companies will eventually catch on  and apply these better technologies in their cars, but not before another few years. These changes always take too much time with these big companies. So in the meantime I'd definitely would like to try one of these conversion kits and hopefully I'm not disappointed.

My intentions of this post is to help everyone to see they have may have an opportunity to be less dependent on oil, and if these ideas worked and everyone started doing this we would closing the gap between the rich and the poor! And if someone says something bad about it I would listen to someone who had the guts the spend the money and install the kit and his/her car.

Other than listening to me, google water -gas and you'll see for yourself that there are a lot of different sites on this, not only to sell you something but also small companies talking about the reaseach they're done on this in the past years and how it works, just a matter of getting it to you for cheap and simple. I also recommend freeenergynews.com.

Answer 4

a conversion that is shown to work, u should check this out:

http://bbayron.water4gas.hop.clickbank.n...

Answer 5

I do not know of any hydrogen conversion kits. But there are LPG or natural gas conversion kits. One of those with minor changes would work for hydrogen. Now where will you get the hydrogen? You can buy propane or LPG or natural gas in many places, but hydrogen in not easy to find and not cheap when you do.

Answer 6

If you are talking about the kits that use power from your cars alternator to produce hydrogen via electrolysis of water, they will certainly produce hydrogen, but they will not increase your gas milage or reduce tail pipe emissions.  In fact, they will decrease gas milage and probably increase emissions.  Google perpetual motion and second law of thermodynamics to find out why.

They are scams.  Don't waste your money.

Answer 7

No, those are likely scams, as hydrogen combustion is terrible and actual fuel cells are incredibly expensive.

Go for electric conversion kits if you have some serious mech. skills.

Answer 8

The ready to fit kits available from SaveFuel.ca come with a 2 year guarantee. Can't see how they can have been in business for 3 years if this technology is a scam, as some would suggest.

They have kits to suit vehicle size from 2lt to large commercial vehicles. Check them out. I am considering importing these kits for resell here in Australia.

A news item here yesterday stated that in the southern state of Victoria, it is estimated that $300,000 worth of fuel is stolen each week, by drivers failing to pay after filling their tank. Not sure how accurate that is, but it either indicates a market for the supplemental hydrogen generators here, or it could be a ploy to help introduce the "pay before you fill" type bowsers here. Another move towards a cashless society!