Do people out there agree with hitting horses for bad behaviour?

Question

Personally i don't agree with it, i would never hit any of my horses, but different people have different views. I mean how much is too much? If you do hit your horse what bad things has he done? I've seen some pretty nasty things at horse shows, and i'm usually the one who steps in and tells the person off for hitting their horse. Does anyone else do this?

Answer 1

the only time iv hit my horse is when she bit me, really hard, it was a slap on the neck. they need to know what is naughty.. but other than that i dont smack her....xxxx

Answer 2

I have never abused a horse in my life or any other animal for that matter, but let me tell you if my horse needs a good smack he will get it.  This "natural horsemanship" is so popular these days with the kids  the new horse owners, so why not act like a horse would out in the pasture if you like the "natural way" if another horse acts up or does something unacceptable, they get kicked or bitten.  You got to get real with these 1200 lb animals that could kill you if they hit or kicked you in the wrong place hard enough, and you being 120 lbs or so, don't have a chance if the horse doesn't understand who is boss.  You do not have to use a sledge hammer to hit, you can use your hand and a strong voice when reprimanding.  Try it, it works. Your horse will respect you, and love you for it.

Answer 3

I agree with Krystle.... my TB was the same way, he would kick out everytime you picked up his back hooves.. i tried to ignore it for the first few weeks, and tried to handle his feet as much as possible. He improved with allowing his feet to be picked up, but he still would try to kick out, an the one time he did get me.. so I gave him a smack on the rump... now when I say smack i mean a quick whap...nothing strong enough to hurt him (or my hand hahaha) just something to show his behavior is unacceptable. However I did find that giving him a smack only made him so much more nervous (which I dont want either).. so now I just scold him (which he responds to extremely well) and he doesnt become upset or nervous.

So i guess my point is that by no means should you EVER abuse your horse and beat the sh*t out of him... but some horses just are pushy an have no manners and need a little smack to get through to them.  

Answer 4

Look, I love my horse to death, and would never hurt him. In the arena when he decides that he has had enough and will begin spinning in circles, i will pull out the crop and tap him, just to get his focus back. I dont think that when you use a crop, it is considered "hitting". If most people didnt ride with a crop, then it could become a dangerous situation and the horse would get out of control. It all depends on your definition of "hitting"

Answer 5

I agree with it. Not with a whip, with your hand on their chest. You can't injure them this way and they will remember that its wrong. I think you should do it for something dangerous like biting or kicking or for the horses own good.

My horse used to kick his door 24/7 when I got him, but by hitting him I stopped him. This was for his own good because he could have damaged his legs.

I just want to say I agree some people take it too far, but I think in some cases it is VERY helpful, you just need to know when to stop.

Answer 6

I don't believe in hitting a horse under any circumstance is right. Discipline on the other hand must be done, but don't be abusive with it. There IS a difference is discipline and abuse.

A horse needs to know who is Alpha (or boss) and show respect and manners, otherwise they will take advantage of the situation.

I had a shetland pony once who had kicked me in her stall, I in turn kicked her back in the butt.  I did NOT kick her hard but enough to let her know I would kick back (just as another horse would in a herd situation) and yelled "NO". She never turned her butt my way again.

I once had an Uncle-in-law (EX now) who used to PUNCH his horses in the mouth for any little thing....it was downright ridiculous. I would constantly yell at him for it....but he didn't care and never quit. And needless to say where I live has nothing in the way of animal rights advocacy groups and even the humane shelter doesn't care.

Now this is someone that shouldn't have animals.

Answer 7

i would never him my horse!!!

if he is bucking and rearing and even if he was trying to kill me i would never hit him!!

Answer 8

I do think there is a difference between hitting (abuse) and disciplining your horse.

A horse is not a human, nor does it think like one, it is a horse, and it will think and act like a horse.

If you would like an example, I can use my TB mare. When I got her 6 months ago she had come from a kill buyers backyard, neglected, skinny and hadnt been handled in some time. It was soon apparant she was the dominant mare of the herd and as she regained her strength, she was acting out more and more of her learned behaviours from living in a huge herd.

The first day I got her, she kicked me when i attempted to pick up her back hooves, I was shocked to say the least but gave her the benefit of the doubt as I was still getting to know her.

After a few days she became very dominant towards humans to the point where I was terrified of being kicked or her kicking someone else. She bit my friend as she tried to rug her, she bit me as I groomed her and watched her eat and she almost took my head off with a huge kick one day as I walked behind her. She also threatened to kick visitors passing in her paddock.

Enough was enough, this mare was going to seriously hurt someone and I considered her behaviour dangerous. Giving her time and space wasnt working and I wasnt going to live in the land of sunshine and butterflies any longer.

So I began retaliating, when she tried to bit me it would end with a smack on the mouth and a sharp NO! When she tried or threatened to kick me, it ended with a wallop on her backside and a very sharp NO! I also advised friends to do this aswell if she threatened them as well, which they did. She understood what it was all for and she learned very quickly.

Now 6 months on, I can say she is much better behaved, she keeps her manners in check and not tried any of this behaviour since, she is healthy and happy and not scarred at all. And of corse I no longer hit her as there is no need.

Sorry that was so long, that was an extreme case of bad behaviour which did require an extreme resopnse.Physicaly puninshing a horse must be done properly and quickly.

There are alot of people who do cross the line from discipline to abuse, and those people should have someone step in, so I do know what you mean. But I dont think people should be close minded to smacking a horse when the need arrises.

EDIT: I totally agree with 1,024 Lusitano Epiphanies, the tone of your voice can be a very powerful tool with how you communicate and express your feelings with your horse. Normaly for me I will scald bad behaviour with my voice first, smacking is a last resort.

Answer 9

There is a very big difference between discipline and abuse.

A smack on the nose for a pony that tries to bite is a reaction that the pony will understand, he won't understand if you say no, bad pony or whatever and he also won't understand if he is chased into a corner and beaten with a stick.

A pony that shows aggression towards people is actually a dangerous animal and needs to be dealt with firmly and instantly in a way that it can understand it's a pecking order situation. Watch horses in the field, that's the way they deal with it among themselves so it is a recognizable and easily understood reaction. It is talking the horse's language if you like.

On the other hand randomly beating an animal (any animal) because it doesn't do what you want is abuse, all it will do is terrify it.

Yes I will step in if I see excessive or unnecessary beating occurring.

Answer 10

You've grown up in a culture where you've heard from all sides that spanking and such are evil.  You're entitled to your opinion, and that's fine.  

I believe most of the time you can find a smarter, better consequence than spanking or hitting, as you say, with animals as well as children.  

But sometimes, a completely unemotional pop on the nose (not a flailing temper tantrum) done immediately and with minimal animation in response to being bitten is the most effective way of teaching a horse not to bite.

Now...like I said, there are smarter ways of dealing with a biter once you know they're a biter...redirection, being aware, etc...but you usually find out you have a biter after he's bitten your ***.

Also, the whip is an attention getter, not a beating tool.  I do not believe that a pop with a crop is abusive to get a horse's attention or to correct something...like running your knees into trees on the trail, etc.

Again...we're talking about a pop, not an angry meltdown.  

"Hitting" as I describe it above...yes, I agree with it.

But, your use of 'hitting' translated in to beating, then no.  I do not agree with beating an animal or a child for any reason.  None.  I am, despite my crusty exterior, a peaceful soul with an aversion to violence.

There are some adults, however, for whom I would make an exception.  

Answer 11

You are a very smart person!!!!!!!!!! But I must say, Discipline and Hitting are two completely different things. So just keep in mind don't yell at people for tapping there horse with a crop or anything.

Answer 12

I agree with a lot of people here.  Discipline is fine; abuse is not.  Think about how horses discipline each other.  We had one mare who let her baby do anything to her she so well pleased.  That baby kicked and bit people, etc, because she had learned to get away from it until we disciplined it out of her.  The other baby, born ten days later, kicked her mother.  Her mother turned around and kicked her right back.  To this day, that baby never has lifted a foot to anyone or anything.  Now, when I smack my horse for biting, etc, I certainly can't do the damage with the flat of my hand that a mare can do with a muscle powered hoof.  People's views on discipline got skewed.  Now, you can get arrested for spanking your child!  I got spanked when I was fresh as a kid, and I am certainly no serial killer or depressed maniac on drugs.  In fact, I'm very respectful of people etc.  I learned right from wrong, and to this day, if I do something wrong, I know how to accept the consequences instead of trying to lay blame elsewhere thinking that nothing bad should ever happen to me.  But don't let the views on people define how to treat your horse.  Be fair in your discipline, and a horse will respect that.  They know how to accept the consequences of their action.  Keep in mind that they are 1000 lbs or more and you might be a tenth of that.

Answer 13

I do not agree with hitting a horse as a form as abuse or to scare the horse.

But I sometimes if they are biting i'll start with a  "No!" and if they keep it up a little tap on the shoulder.

Never would I touch a horse on their head or if they did something wrong while under saddle.

I see a huge differecne between what I do compared to some.

Also my horses are old and just cheeky, not scared or not knowing when they bite is wrong.

I'd never ever touch anyone elses or a young or timid horse this way.

I do often see at shows people who don't win hit their horse, this happens at dog shows aswel.

If the dog doesn't win, they will smack it.

Well done for telling off those people who hit their horse.

Answer 14

I do not agree with letting a horse boss me around, but I also do not agree in abuse of horses for bad behavior. If my horse bites me, I will smack his nose because otherwise he learns that he is the alpha. In the wild, if he were to do this to the alpha horse he would be punished as well. However, at horse shows I have seen people hit their horses for things like hitting a pole or making mistakes in a routine. This is very wrong! The way a horses memory works, you must punish a horse within three seconds of when it made its mistake. If I cannot punish my horse within these three seconds, I wont punish it because in his mind I would be hitting him for nothing. So a horse wont understand if you hit him for having a bad routine, his brain just wont connect the two.

Answer 15

As an older rider, those of you that indicated using a good firm slap right away to discipline are correct.Generally in the area of where the action took place-on the rump if stricking out with a rear leg or chest if front leg,etc. The person suggesting the 2 rules is wise as you discipline.While a horse is obvious not quite human, they do understand discipline when you mean it in getting their attention as a loving parent can choose to do on the seat of a childs britches if they don't listen to instructions. This doesn't constitute abuse or out of control. But you can regretfully have an out of control horse or child if you don't get their attention right away and be consistant.Always show love in your discipline and of course other times.

Answer 16

I "tap" my horses horses when they do something wrong. Sure it's more than a tap, but its too much to call it a "hit". If its something minor like when they lip you, I "tap" their noses. But I have found  myself to slap a horse on occassion, like if they kick you, or bite you when you cinch up the girth. The truth is, you can never truly hurt a horse with just your hand, unless your absolutely pshyco. I, like you have seen some pretty crude punishments for little things like not picking up a hoof to pick, that is unnacceptable, but an occassional "tap" is ok in my opinion.

Answer 17

I wouldnt tel somebody else what to do because their horse could have done something extremley wrong. i hit my horse but only whith the crop or a tap on his nose when hes done things like step on my toe or broken something if he refuses a jump id never tell him of id just let him do it again but if he does something that e knows he shouldnt as soo as hes done it he ries to run away from me or hides in his stable because he knows that hes done something wrong but i never hit him hard no no ive only ever used a crop 4 times  

Answer 18

Smacking a horse is a good check on their behavior once in a while. Most parents do it also. I only hit my horse when shes doing something stupid. Like trying to smash my against the wall in the wash stall. She always trying to prove herself as lead mare. And I put her in check with a good smack. Once in a while she'll try to kick me, very rarely but she gets a big smack after that. I don't agree beating your horse for everything it does wrong. I've seen some gruesome scenes at shows. But they do need to know their place.

Answer 19

Horses don't think like people they think like horses and in the wild horses fight for dominance. If you just sit back and let your horse get away with it then don't come crying to me when you get kicked in the head.

A slap every now and again is necessary. I did however hear a number of stories of people thrashing their horses with branches and that is very wrong. You do just enough to make sure the horse respects you.

Answer 20

Hitting horses is terrible!  I have a 6 year old TB which i have had since he was 4.  We had real trouble turning him out in his field...he reared up, struck out, kicked you and then bolted!  I got so many injuries from him.  This still happened up until 6 months ago until i moved yards.  When i was at the other yard a man who was another livery came down to the field with me and took i lunge whip behind him, when he reared up he smacked him with the whip really hard.  I immediately stepped in and had a go at him.  One of the other liveries told me to smack him on his front legs when he went up and another to kick him in the belly!  I was appalled!  Now we have moved yards none of this happens and everyone has a much more relaxed approach and more sensitive.  He is like a different horse!  This just goes to show it is much more effective than hitting.  The horses simply don't understand why they are being hit.  Sorry this is long but i feel so strongly on this subject.

X  

Answer 21

Depends on what you mean by "hitting".

If a tap of a crop on a lazy horse is "hitting" I am not against it.

If the horse has just offered to bite you and within three seconds you smack him - I am not against it.

If the horse is rude and crowding you in a dangerous manner, where you are going to get hurt - and you weild a crop to establish your "personal space" - I am not against it.

I AM against the morons that hit the horse because they are embarrassed because he won't ; get on a trailer / won't jump / won't stand / won't lift his feet and so on.

These are training issues that the horse has not learnt properly, not bad behavior.

Yup - I'm the one that steps in at that point as well.

I actually bought a pony at a show that was being whipped to get on the trailer and was all white rimmed and lathered up. The moron owner had not realized that the horse already ON the trailer was threatening the pony and telling her NOT to come in here...

Answer 22

I dont routinely beat my horses, but if , say they nip or bite at me, i see nothing wrong with either a firm slap on the neck or a light-ish thump on the nose or under the chin to discourage the behaviour....that is pretty much the only time i will hit my horses..so i never do because they have all learned not  to bite...none of them are head-shy...in case you are going to say that...

I have also seen a lot of people beat their horses at shows...I am appalled by this...these people don't know what they are doing (one chick thought she was a big shot barrel racer and she couldnt ride a stick horse if she tried...) anyways she started beating her horse after her run because she knocked over all 3 barrels & she was pissed off...we called the SPCA...we have done it before...its better to let the professionals deal with animal abuse...the rider/owner is not going to listen to you at all...the SPCA will most likely fine them if they see them beating the horse or if you can get a couple pictures or a video of it happening....

Answer 23

I am one to smack a horse on the nose or butt, if they tried to bite me, or kick, and if i had a crop i would swat him/her on the butt for kicking at me. You have to remember that horses are a herd animal, they need to know there boundaries. You (and me) are the alpha, and we are not going to be walked over the top of. Especially because they weigh 1000+ lbs, and I'm only about 110. So, when my pushy TB tries to bite my she gets a smack on the nose as her 'discipline'. There is a big difference between discipline, and abuse. Sometimes i hear of people who have rescued drafts, and the previous owners used 2x4s over a draft horses nose, that IS abuse,  and i would NEVER, EVER do something like that.

Answer 24

  The only time you should strike a horse is when it is purposely doing something that if not immediately corrected will get someone seriously hurt.

Rule number 1. is never let a yourself or a nother person get injured.

Rule number 2. is never let the horse get injured but 1. takes precedence over 2 every time.

Answer 25

Beating and hitting are two different things...a slap on the chest (more to surprise the horse, more than anything) versus smacking him repeatedly on the neck because he ticked you off are separate entities.  If a horse lunged at me to bite, I very well may smack him on the chest and accompany it with a "HEY! WATCH it!" or something simlar.  But that's pretty much it.  I like to use the tone of my voice to discipline more than anything else.  It depends on the circumstances, of course, but you can really communicate a lot through tone and volume.  Your voice is an instantaneous reaction - a slap on the neck, not so much so.  If you can't call attention to a horse's behavior within a couple seconds of him performing the behavior, chances are he's not going to equate your reaction with anything he did.  That is why I like using my voice...even if I'm far away, it works instantly, every time.

Answer 26

The only time it is justified to hit your horse while on the ground hard enough to be painful is when the horse performs an action that can be classified as dangerous. This includes kicking while you are picking up feet, attempting to bite, stepping on your foot, that sort of thing. In those instances the best response is a very quickly delivered open hand slap, done with as much force as possible, to the flank, barrel,  shoulder or neck, immediately following a very loud version of the cue you use for rebuking the horse (something to mean "whatever you're doing don't do it again") - I use a "ch" sound for that purpose, because "no" is too much like "whoa".

For a well-trained horse, being treated normally, this will seldom if ever be needed.

In the saddle things are a little different, and it also depends on the context. In most cases, spurs or crop are used for corrections and are intended to be used as gently as possible. Spurs can be used at a touch level for correcting an improper response. Crops require as much or more force than spurs, and again, should be used primarily to reinforce a correct interpretation of the aids.

In a riding context it is occasionally necessary to use spur or crop in a more intense fashion to rebuke potentially dangerous behavior. A horse that is prancing uncontrollably sideways into a fence or arena wall can crush your leg and you need to send a clear signal that this is inappropriate. Spurs and crop can be critical for this if nothing else is working, but you need to start soft and escalate quickly until the behavior stops or you are about to stimulate a buck or other even more dangerous response (in which case you may have to leap off the horse to avoid danger, and risk a different injury). Even here, it is rare that simply making the horse go forward, back or sideways using normal cues and aids will not be sufficient to refocus the horse on your desires - if the horse is well trained and you have established yourself as their leader.

In a training context, negative reinforcement with crop or spur, sometimes forcefully, may play a greater part in working with the horse. However, excessive use of negative reinforcement sours a horse in training and leads to anxious, frightened, "neurotic", belligerent or stubborn horses. When training on the ground, use of crop, lead rope or even hand to push or rebuke a horse being trained may also be necessary and might be interpreted by some as "hitting". As usual, the minimum force needed to deter the behavior should be used, and it MUST always follow some sort of rebuke cue (such a "ch" or "hey") or the horse will not learn what you don't want them doing, or will learn it very slowly.

This is a long answer, but the topic is more difficult than when someone wants to talk about "hitting horses for no reason or out of frustration" to which the answer is - no, that is never justifiable.

Answer 27

I agree with you. But i do also agree with Pans'Mom. *High Five* for telling those people. I dont hit my horse beacue she has never done anything REALLY bad.

Answer 28

There is a difference between disciplining and cruelty, a quick slap does no harm, remember a horse is a hundred times more powerful then a human so it will do them no harm only teach them a lesson. For example i knew of someone who was bitten by a horse, so she bit him back and believe me he NEVER bit her again.

I used to have a young 16'2hh Irish draught and if i hadn't disciplined him i would have had a whole host of problems, if he needed a smack he got one to show him who was boss.  He now belongs to a girl i know and wins showjumping and eventing competitions all the time and he's as quiet as a mouse

As someone stated in a herd situation a horse will be put in it's place through biting or kicking, not through patience.

Unfortunately i've seen many a horse take advantage by not been given proper discipline

Answer 29

It depends on what you mean but hitting (as some people have already said).  I believe in disciplinary "hitting" (I don't hit them abusively).  A lot of horses tend to test their boundaries; if they figure out that you don't care if they bite you, than they will do it all the time.  If one of my horses tries to do something naughty, I'll give them a pop in the nose using the palm of my hand or something.  I don't hit them hard, it's more like saying "no, this is my personal bubble and you are not allowed in unless invite you".  I have four horses, and I (like most people) stay at the barn for long periods of time, usually after I'm exhausted from earlier that day and don't need a horse grabbing my cloths or trying to kick me.  There is abusive hitting, where people hurt their horses, I don't hurt my horses, I'm assertive toward them.  You have less than two second to discipline them for their actions, anytime after that, than that's just hitting because they don't know why their being hit.  You need to declare your dominate role as the leader, horses are bigger than you and can hurt you quite badly.  If your riding the horse, and it does something wrong, you need to correct it just like that; you can't beat them after wards.  There are some people that go way over the top, that needs to be stopped, but then there's being assertive, which is toatally different.  

Answer 30

I do not agree with beating on a horse, but a well placed slap will pretty much only hurt your hand and his feelings.  If you watch horses in a herd situation, other horses do not correct wrongdoers by using patience, ignoring, gentle petting.....their corrections are quick and to the point and can involve some pretty intense physical correction.  As another poster, if I have one that is biting, a well timed pop on the side of the mouth will work, and I've not had problems with them getting head shy.  But timing is everything.  You can't get bit, sit there and moan about your bleeding body part, go in and wash off, and come back out and pop the horse.  It has to be immediate.  That way the horse connects it as a cause and effect.  "OK....I bit, and I got a pop on the side of the mouth....I don't like that, so I don't think I'll try that one again for a while...."  

Now, a question.  Do you consider riding with a crop and using it to be "hitting".  If so, guilty as charged.  Correctly used, a crop is just a reinforcement.  I had one horse that if I left the crop or spurs at home, he'd just tune out and be generally unresponsive.  I would have to really use my heels strongly to get him to respond at all.  But if I just touched him with a crop or spurs, he was a totally different ride.  Alert, responsive, willing; and I don't believe it was out of "fear", it was just the cues he was trained for.

Answer 31

certainly not!

i must agree

hitting horses will not solve anything

i must congratulate you!

your so courageous and brave to tell those people off!

what if they do something to you

but no! you marched to them and told them that they shouldnt do it!

you definitely deserve a medal! :D

i have experienced that hitting horses can do no good to them

the only thing the horses will do is either be afraid and do their job lousily

or get into a temper that they break some things or someone

no. bad behaviour should be treated with patience

because i know that in time

they would learn to calm down

as long as they have a patient voice leading the way

my pleasure! :D