Do you agree or disagree with horses being....?

Question

FR3SHMAN that's your opinion. To be honest I don't agree but I'm going to respect that maybe you should work on being respectful too.

Answer 1

Well when you are lounging most horses need a whip, even ones trained to voice commands. But whipping a horse from the ground when you are grooming it and it gets pushy or something can be quite harsh. But horses are dangerous animals, so a small habit of being pushy and getting into your space can really become dangerous, and sometimes the only way to cure it is to give them a little tap with your hand

Answer 2

I never hit my horse when he's bad because it would make him headshy and scared of me, which is NOT what I want. I can understand people who give their horse a sharp tap with the whip every now and then when their horse is being lazy, but personally I think a little tickle with the schooling whip is better encouragement that a smack on the shoulder.

:)

Answer 3

only if they are repeating the behavior...like biting i know a horse that started to bite you would just give her a mild smack on the chest after a few times she stopped...so i only think it should be used for certain things

Answer 4

If one more person quotes "natural" horsemanship I may scream....The only thing natural about it is the TITLE some guy gave it.

Natural to a HORSE is how a HORSE would behave.

You will not see a horse in a herd environment "nicely" asking another to leave his hay alone - they will threaten in a very obvious manner with ears teeth butt and hooves. They will not yell at each other.

Horses understand body language and instant FAIR reprimands.They don't do "time outs".

A horse that bites you needs an instant - and I mean INSTANT smack - then you continue with exactly what you were doing and include loving on his face. You don't run away crying - he wins. You don't stand there hollering at his face   - he wins. cuz you stopped doing whatever he didn't want you to do.

I have reformed many "nippers" and aggressive horses this way and none of them are headshy.

Horses are not humans - they are not babies - they are 1000 plus pounds of instinctive THINKING animals that will remember in 2 ways.

#1 through repitition.

#2 through a bad experience.

Good and bad things are learnt because humans do it over and over again - if you constantly jerk the mouth when you jump, the horse will soon stop jumping...then you bring out a crop re inforcing the idea that jumping is a bad thing to do. since you hit him before the jump...









  

Answer 5

I beleive in enforcing boundaries for my horses.They are horses, not humans, and I treat them as another horse would.  If my horse is misbehaving out in the pasture, his "boss", leader of the herd, will nip at, bite, or kick him to let him know the behavior is NOT acceptable(often times all it takes is a look).



When I work with my horse I do the same thing.  If he tries to bite, he gets a smack, followed by a pause long enough for him to forget what he's done, then I scratch him again.  I do the same if he tries to kick, or invades my space without my permission.  I act like another horse would act to keep him in his place, and I do it with any horse I work with.  You want your horse to trust you, but they have to have MORE RESPECT for you than trust.  If they think of you as their buddy, they will walk all over you, but if you show some good leadership they will respect you and trust you more because they will know that you won't put them in a dangerous situation on purpose.

Answer 6

I think hitting is okay as long as its not on the face. It really doesnt hurt that bad, and "popping the halter" is an equal to hitting( I do both, depending if the halter is even on). I dont get y u think its not okay to use a whip on the ground, but you can use one when riding? A whip is a whip and its no more than a training aid. Some people do abuse the whip, but I think in most circumstances whips are fine. U dont whip the horse, u whip the ground, and if the horse doesn't go, u tap them with the whip. U dont hit a horse with it ever! If a horse refuses a jump I think it needs a lot more ground training..... But I think you should always try to train a horse "natrually" first and if it doesn't work for that specific horse than you have to go to tougher training.

Answer 7

i dont agree with hitting a horse, using spurs, crops, and bits other than a D-ring, Full Cheek, and loose ring with bit guards...i dont agree with hackamores either and i dont agree with polo wraps and i dont agree with breaking WB's before they are 5yrs of age and the list goes on haha i just think that if u understand WHY a horse does something then u will realize that there are better ways that dont cause "side-effects" such as hitting a horse...if you hit a horse they will stop biting you(etc)...yes...but that will cause them to be head shy which makes it harder for equine dentisits and you too when u are bridiling them or putting their halter on or grooming their face. so really ur just creating a problem as u solve one...

Answer 8

I see no problem with using a crop when mounted. I use mine for jump refusals (though my current horse has never once refused after 6mths or so over fences, so, so far not nessecary), bucking, rearing, refusal to canter/move forward. It's an english crop with a big flap on it and makes more noise then it hurts.

Ground manners wise, I am fairly strict with my horses. If my horse is on the lead with no chain (which is anytime except when I'm letting her graze or else it is impossible to get her to move) and acts up [not stopping when I stop, pulling out of the path of direction that we are heading in (i.e. ducking into a stall as we pass), crowding me/stepping on my feet (not by accident, but because she is paying attention to something else and walked into me, that is disrespectful)] then she has to back up, for which is dependent on the severity of whatever she did. And, normally, I will slap her on the chest with the rope to show her that this is unnacceptable. So far, being lightly hit with a soft cotton rope after acting up doesn't bother her. If she is wearing a chain, I will snap on the chain once or twice and make her back up. Nipping at me in any way would mean I would VERY lightly open hand slap her across the nose (not crazy horse abuse I said lightly).

Answer 9

If you don't discipline a horse properly Aka a slap then you will have a lot of problems. That is how people end up getting kicked in the head.

Answer 10

You should never hit your horse as a punishment when you're on the ground, the only thing you might teach it is to react after the misbehavior faster then you can hit it, as example: a lot of people believe if your horse nipps or bites, you gotta hit it on the mouth!?. It will learn pretty quick to nip you and then pull the head away before you can react. Of course there has to be some sort of punishment for that, I usually use my voice in a way that let's the horse know it did something it deserves to die for, and it can't escape from my voice.

The use of a crop for encouraging when riding, like tapping - no hitting, is ok, let's talk Natural Horsemenship : Suggest - Ask - Tell - Command, for the Command - part I use the crop - but rather in an annoying  then hurting way.

Edit:

Nope, I didn't think that, you cleared that already in your question and previous edits, for all those that think a horse needs to be punished in a physical way for misbehaving - the horse will always learn from your reaction, some might get the message, some others learn to escape the punishment in different ways - flight, or, whats worse, - fear which might lead to self defense - more, harder and better aimed kicking, rearing, bucking or bolting.

Answer 11

in some situations yes. if the horse KNOWS he shoulnt be doing something and is just being a jerk then its ok to do sparingly, but if the horse just doesnt know any better then i disagree with hitting them. it just depends. i hit my horse on the nose when hes nipping at me for a treat because its a bad behavior, but if hes unsure about something i definatly wont hit him!

Answer 12

It depends on the situation really.  When I ride, I MAY carry a crop but I only use it if the horse if being extremely stubborn and not doing what I know it can do.  I do firmly believe that sometimes horses to need a little slap to get their attention, but just hard enough to get their attention - not hard enough to injure them.  For example, I was in picking my horses hooves and she was giving me a hard time about it and kept putting her feet back down.  After the 3rd time I gave her a slap on the side and told her to knock it off.  The next time I reached for her hoof she held there no problem at all - she was just being stubborn and I let her know that wasn't acceptable.

Answer 13

This question was asked yesterday, and from the answers some people gave I have this to add-

You could never hurt a horse as much as it can hurt you. A slap will not put the horse in pain, it may shock him a little but you can not hurt him. If you have ever watched herd behaviour horses will kick, strike and bite eachother with as much force as they can muster. So to say 'I dont hit my horse cos I dont want to hurt him' is rubbish, you cannot hit your horse hard enough to actually cause him pain.

Some horses are well mannered enought that raising your voice is all it takes, and thats great! But untill youve had a kick from a Thoroughbreds huge hoof (with shoes) inches from your face, I dont think anyone who thinks 'hitting is bad' can comment.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions and I do respect that. People will do what works for them, and if its a sharp tug on the lead rope for bad behaviour that works, then thats excellent. But untill youve been in a situation where a good whack is the only thing that will make a horse safe to be around, i dont think anyone has the right to critisize it.

Im not talking about any person in particular, just about the general vibe I got from some of the comments here.

EDIT:

I horse will become headshy if he is hit in the face for NO reason. A quick smack for a bite will be received as due punishment for bad behaviour

Answer 14

It really depends on what the horse is doing i guess if the horse bit me or something i might smack its nose but not to hard but if it was just being playful and nibbling my pocket i would just tell it no and make it stop but it all depends on the situation

Answer 15

Well...

I feel that when a horse is misbehaving or being lazy on a lesson or just being a brat they need a tap, definitly not a hit, to get back into the right direction. For instance when i give lessons, if the horse comes to the middle and stops instead of picking up a trot, i will tap him or her on the hindquarters and get them going. I dont think that anyone should continuosly "hit" a horse. That is just cruelty. Also another thing i do instead of hitting is get out the whip. Not use it, but just get it out to scare the horse. Everyone has a different take of what a hit is, but if its cruelty you can tell.

As far as bad, thats a different view too. Somepeople just have ornry horses and some people just think a horse should be "perfect"  

Answer 16

Its depends. I have had some troubel with horses and i will NOT hit them in the face. I think that is wrong but a mild slap to the chest usually does the trick. I dont whip from theground either I use a crop. So I agree with you to an extent if you know what i mean? hahah well good topic by the way :)

Answer 17

Charlotte, you aren't interested in respectful conversation- all you want to do is argue. I believe that whips and crops have their place in horse training, and that when a horse does something which it shouldn't, it's up to the owner or handler to discipline the animal in a humane, correct, and fair way. In classical dressage, the whip is used as a signalling device and an extension of the rider's arm or hand, much like the turn signal on a car. It is NOT used to beat or punish the horse- and there is a HUGE difference between discipline and abuse, one which you seem to be having trouble grasping right now. Beating a horse because it won't do something is abuse- but giving a horse a light tap on the rump with a whip to tell the animal where to step or to pick up its feet is not. Likewise, I never use a whip to ask my mare to canter or to trot- I do that with my LEGS, which is what one is SUPPOSED TO USE. If your horse needs to be whipped to get it to change gaits, something's wrong- and not just little bit wrong, either. Using a whip to get a horse to move from one gait to another is a sign of poor training and lack of education on the part of both horse and rider. It means you need to take lessons so you can learn how to ride correctly and use your legs, and your horse needs to go to a trainer who can teach him to move off the leg and work off the aids, rather than having to depend on a whip.

As for ground schooling ( such as longeing, for example) I normally just use sound to get my mare to change gaits- she knows her voice commands and usually listens pretty well. Beating her is NOT necessary- and the only purpose it would serve would be to make her afraid of me, which is not what I or anyone else would want. If I am driving horses in from the pasture to the barn, I will crack a whip on the ground near them- but I never actually will hit anyone. I have had a longe whip used ON ME when I was a kid, and I NEVER forgot that experience. The lash caught me across the top of my right leg, and it took many months for the resulting welt and injury to heal. Since then, I have never been able to wield such a whip with force, because I know what it means to be hit with one.

Spurs are another story altogether. I use spurs, and so do most people I know. They are like a whip in that they have their place in training a horse, so long as they are correctly used. My mare tends to be rather lazy and slow without them, and I have to work twice as hard as necessary to get her to do things. Wearing spurs means we can both get more done in less time,with less effort and struggle on my part. The spurs I use are not sharp, and do not have rowels on them which can pinch. Spur usage is required in some horse sports- and in dressage, especially at the international or Olympic level, it is MANDATORY. The rules of that sport specify that spurs are required- and if you watch the videos of this year's Games, you will see that ALL the riders have spurs on during their tests. Again, the issue with spurs is not that people use them, it's how they MISUSE them which causes problems.

This is just my take on this.

Answer 18

As far as regular whoop'ins. No. I think it's a bad thing for sure. But I can tell you if a horse maliciously bites hard or kicks (at) me, They will definitely get a spank-en. I will not have a horse that will hurt someone and I'm sure having a heart to heart talk won't convince him not to do it again.

Answer 19

yes and no...

When riding - I dont carry a crop - I never have and never will. I think horses that refuse or act up when being ridden do so due to bad riding - confused signals or the rider leaving it all up to them to do the work.

An alert and competent rider will always be on top of the horses thinking and will guide them correctly to a fence or whatever. Horses that act up out of greeness should in my opinion, taught to do it correctly via a nurturing - sympathetic way instead of getting whacked about the head.

From the ground point of view - a horse that is forming a bad habit - such as biting or kicking or storming out of a stable or something - then yes it is acceptable to give them a firm slap accompanied by a NO! but not excessive beating.

xx

Answer 20

i don't think i've ever hit my horse lol.  

Answer 21

I believe in reprimanding unacceptable behavior - rudeness, pushing, nipping, biting, kicking, pawing, etc., immediately and fairly. A horse with great ground manners is a happy horse that can be handled well by a variety of people. The way I look at it is everything I do, including enforcing a fair and reasonable code of conduct, makes him a better horse all the way around. The unhappiest horses are the ones that don't know or understand what is expected of them, have no routine or schedule or job, and no boundaries and structure to guide them.

Yeah, when my horse first tried to lift his leg while getting a bath to warn me he was going to kick, I smacked him and said no, making a big deal about it. That was 4 years ago and he's never lifted his leg since. The hit didn't phase him, it was the tone of voice and little foot stomping thing I did ("My Mama's CRAZY").

Take another horse that lifts his leg and the owner either doesn't see it as the first sigh or doesn't believe in reprimand, 4 years down the road you read about something like this: my horse is always kicking out at me when I try to give him a bath or treat his leg for xyz, what do I do? Someone will eventually get hurt. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm actually a big softie, not some beater of horses. I just think a slap when needed is much better than turning the other cheek. I know my horse is silently laughing at me when I do it bc there's no way it can really hurt, but the message is clear: not acceptable, straighten up buddy. Sometimes when he tests certain areas, I actually see a little gleam in his eye that says: good, she's still paying attention and I can count on her to guide and take care of me, followed by a loud relaxed snort and l*****g and chewing.

Rules: Never the head or face. Never after 3 seconds. Never when mad or emotional. Never hitting just to hit...ewhhhhh.

So I do agree with it and that's why. I've seen too many horses that are allowed to just do whatever they want and they're a nightmare and often totally confused about their place in the world. That's what makes me sad. Or worse, the owner who can't ever hit their horse bc it's so mean or cruel that gets dragged then run over by their beloved horse while trying to do a simple thing like leading them in from the pasture.

ADD: I wanted to mention since someone said if you hit a horse anywhere they become head shy...my guy gets his slap when he deserves it (never on the head), like I said earlier. The equine dentist I use doesn't even have to sedate him to do his teeth! I just put my hand on his neck and talk to him and he's such a good boy...

I've seen people who enjoy hitting their horse. That makes me sick.

I've also seen people who hit their horse for every little thing that, usually, the owner doesn't even understand why it's wrong or if it is at all.

Answer 22

It depends, like if the horse is on your foot and he wont get off and your foot is breaking. But i hate it when people hit their horses just for the sake of it. Or when they hit their horses in the face.

Answer 23

usally hitting horses with crops doesn't hurt b/c they are so muscular it's the sound that gets them to pay attention to you not the fell and i on;y agree with using a crop if th horse is being stoubron or think they can take atvantage of you  

Answer 24

my horse is REALLY naughty when i first ride her.. like terribly fighting to swich gaits on me so i will stop and back her up and spin her in circles in both directions and back her again otherwise she will NOT stop.. but on bad days she will rear up when i back her and she will rear up and i smack then top of her head so she will stop rearing.. or she will just keep rearing and rearing without caring. so unless she is really bad i will just tap her and say no or back/circle/back her.