Do you think the gender pay gap can be explained without discrimination?

Question

Someone just asked a question about the unequal choice men and women have as to whether or not they want to work. I believe this is the true source of the pay gap. I believe the pay gap occurs because women don't demand as much money as men. This is because they actually have two major choices as to what they wan to do with their lives. They can either be a stay at home wife or get a professional job. (with a third option of juggling both) Therefore, if they choose to go the professional route, everyone celebrates that they got the job. It is not as important what the job pays. Society views her as a strong model simply because she is in the position. On the other hand, men have to go into the workforce. Regardless of the propaganda, it is very unlikely a man will meet a woman who wants to "take care" of him financially. Therefore, the only way a man can distinguish himself is to be payed more money than his peers. So, he demands more in the interview.

Answer 1

nope to me its like saying blacks should get payed less because there black.... and im sure most people don't want to get a job because of being a women ect they would much rather feel they earned it

Answer 2

From what I've learned, discrimination accounts for approximately 10% of the wage gap. The other 90% is explained by other factors, including personal choice.

"Men have to go into the workforce"? No, they don't. They can stay home, too. That's just the way it's seen by people who are stuck in the past.

Answer 3

In my field, the general rule is that if you hire a person away from another company, you pay them about 5-10% more than they were making before.  That's interesting, because if I found out a female coworker were making less than me, it could be the fault of our current employer, or her previous employer, her employer from two jobs ago, etc.

Answer 4

I would consider myself a feminist and I still agree with you.

Women are more often met with expectations of raising children then men are. They are also often faced with the difficulty of raising children and working at the same time. So it coincides with that that women will under perform in comparison to men. Because they will not be able to work as much overtime, they will need to stay home because there kids are sick, they will be juggling the "Mommy Timmy flushed my goldfish down the toilet" calls. It's a stereotype but it is often true. So it makes sense that they would be paid less. More often then not men are not faced with these challenges.

It's not discrimination. It's life.

Answer 5

I worked at the same restaurant as my boyfriend for around two years. I say around because he got fired than rehired at that same restaurant so I'm not exactly sure how long we worked together. Around the same time he got fired a lot of people quit.  I stayed and helped out as much as I could. I worked over time almost every week and learned everything I could. I constantly asked for a raise because I had been working so hard. After two months of asking and hearing "I'll request it tomorrow" I finally got $1 an hour raise. I was stoked. Well about a month later they rehired my boyfriend, at the same amount that I was being paid, keep in mind he got fired too. That made me really angry because not only did I have more experience than him (I actually had to train him) but I helped out the restaurant when they really needed the help. When I told them I thought it was unfair they said that I shouldn't be talking with him about our wages and that they had just given me a raise so they wouldn't give me another one. A month after that my boyfriend was making not 1 not 2 but $4 dollars more than me. That was justified by the fact that he had improved so much since he had gotten FIRED. I quit that job in a hurry, but now try to tell me that that was not discrimination. I didn't not get my raise for lack of trying either.

Answer 6

I strongly disagree with your view as once again you're assuming all men and women are alike. Some women DO demand as much money as men; guess what-some of us demand money when men won't. I've negotiated for pay many times and did not back down. Not that long ago I was told I had to take a full-time position instead of having multiple contracts and was told I had to accept a pittance of an increase in pay as that's what they always did. Both men and women at my workplace said that's the way it was. I said I don't care what you all do or what they do to others-at minimum-I'm not accepting less pay for more work. I was threatened with being fired and I said go ahead I'm not backing down. My ex-President of my work location refused to tell me what my pay would be so I had to wait until the day my contracts expired to find out what the new pay rate would be-my managers above me and my peers could not believe I would not just accept the shoddy treatment like they all had. I got what I demanded and no one could believe it. Usually our employees had to leave and be chased after later before they got any pay increases of any kind. Not all women are push-overs hon. Some of us are tough as nails. I have willingly chosen to change careers and make a pittance-but  no one is telling me they're going to pay me low wages because they can with others. I haven't heard of a single man who was willing to do what I did at my workplace. Not all women are alike in spite of your opinion of them.

Edit: For the poster who thinks you have a right to obtain payroll records-you have got to be kidding! I've worked for many Fortune 500 companies and the first thing they have you sign on the first day of work is an agreement not to discuss your pay rate or make any demands regarding payment information - if you refuse to sign you will not be hired. On the agreements I was told to sign-the consequences for discussing your pay is dismissal-forget about requesting payroll records! Oh yeah unequal pay is illegal-but it is nearly impossible to prove now and has always been difficult. A recent Supreme Court decision requires that unequal pay claims have to be made within 6 months of the offense or you can not sue-so companies just have to keep quiet about their wages for 6 months and then they can do whatever they want. The decision has pretty much made the equal pay act unenforceable.

Answer 7

The facts are clear. The feminists spin nonsense.

The average man works 7hr/wk longer. He takes more risks. He works harder and smarter.

The average woman takes regular "me time" holidays.

The gender gap is caused by women.

Answer 8

yes i do, i do

Answer 9

Wow, I cant wait for some feminists to get all fired up on this one...but I agree basically with you.  I think men are more aggressive naturally and in some ways more overtly confident, and therefore expect/demand more money that women do...i also think women dont take as much initiative as they could to seek equal pay.  I know payroll records are private, but if you suspect that you are paid less than a man for the same work you have the right to obtain records to support or disprove that.  And unequal pay is openly illegal.

Answer 10

Excuse me, but have you ever gone hungry because the money went to pay for food for the kids or the pets?

I have, and I resent your Barbie dream girl picture of the world.

Certainly some women CHOOSE not to be as ambitious as men, but that does not explain the deficiancy, and the fact that men (and some women) who hire, when they first sit down at the bargaining table, are willing, from the word go, to pay more to the man than to the woman.  It's NOT just that men have greater negotiating skills - it's because deep down inside these hiring agents have envisioned a man in the job, and they low-ball the woman applicant.  So that is all most women get offered, the low-ball take-it-or-leave it offers.  The next applicant can be a man with less or equal credentials, and they can go in and get a first offer that is higher than the high offer to the woman.

Now do you understand what we are talking about.

Personal experience.  Hired as the (experienced) Women's Gymnastics Coach for a Middle School and a High School.  Later a man with no experience was hired - brand new teacher - I assumed for the unfilled Mens Coach position.  Law states that the salaries for women's coaches MUST be the same as mens, even though I had three times as many girls in the program as boys.  However, the Administration pulled a twist so he would get more money.  They changed the promised structure of the positions and he was made the Head Coach and I as made the Assistant Coach - without my knowledge of the change, or any reductions in my duties.  .  Neither of us knew.  He got paid twice the yearly stipend as I did.  That is discrimination!  I sued and won!

Answer 11

When I tried to return to work after I had a baby, my boss said the only position open was the night shift - a bit difficult with the old DAYcare situation. I didn't have the resources, time  or energy to fight, so I quit.

I returned to the same line of work four years later, but had to start all over again on the pay scale, earned vacation time, pension contributions, seniority, etc.

I used to make more than my husband. Now he makes more than me because he never lost that continuity.

So, in short I blame biology (child-rearing) for a lot of the inequality.

But hey, the kids are happy - and it's a lot worse for the single moms I know in the workforce.

And yes, female bosses are just as nasty about making it difficult for women to return to work after having kids.

Answer 12

"Therefore, if she chooses to go the professional route, everyone celebrates that she got the job. It is not as important what the job pays. Society views her as a strong model simply because she is in the position."

I don't know what your definition of discrimination based on s*x is, but that scenario sure sounds like it to me.

Answer 13

My perception is similar (having seen the entry level interview process with graduating engineers).  I don't remember a single female who didn't have an offer at graduation.  I couldn't say that about the males some of whom had to wait months before getting an offer.  It seemed as though companies would very much like to give the women an offer.  I think the male engineers who had to wait for an offer were better at the subject than some of the females who had already received offers.

So I would think that companies would at least compensate with the same attitude.