Does anyone else agree that a black belt is only a color?

Question

what i mean is, i know someone who knows 17 different styles of martial arts and he used to teach in germany and i beilive ive heard him say that he has seen a lower rank belt beat a black belt, so maybe what he was saying is its not the style its the fighter?

Answer 1

black belt represents many things in m.a. and skill is one of them. inferior skill can always beat superior skill because it's all about strategy. in korea they wear all black uniforms traditionally because white represents death.

Answer 2

I believe that there are natural fighters who can beat most black belts. I also see the 'black belt' as more of an intellectual accomplishment, like a college degree, than an indicator of how 'tough' someone is. There are ex-cons and current inmates of all varieties who see black belts as a joke, and they can beat most black belts to a pulp.  

Answer 3

in certain martial arts, belt promotions are meaningless. they are trivial, and they are business plots. i'll tell you why it works:

if you go in and work out and all that, you want a reward, this is common in western culture as parents use rewards to teach their children. so when you get your red stripe on your orange belt in goju karate you haven't really accomplished anything, but you're visually satisfied.

HOWEVER, in certain martial arts, suchas my art, my favorite, gracie jiu jitsu, belts and stripes reflect tremendously upon the players skill.

In my academy, a single striped white belt never beats a double striped white belt. same for two v. three, 3 v. 4. etc.

In these martial arts where it does reflect skill, the advanced players may not have drastically advanced arsenals, but indeed they have hours upon hundreds of hours of repetition of basic positional escapes and simple submissions.

For example:

In 18 months of chito ryu karate, when i was only 10 years old i received 5 belt promotions and was only 2 belts (six months about) away from my black belt. i realized it was ineffective and meaningless when i noticed a white belt weighing 15 pounds more then me could defeat me as easily as i could he.

Team Renzo Gracie Ottawa, has a minimum 18 month for ONE promotions, minimum, most people spend over two years for their first advancement. then 24 month minimum until the next promotion, minimum. In the end a good, dedicated trainer will take over 10 years of 5+ a week training to achieve black belt status.

i agree and disagree with you. it depends on the art and the school.

Answer 4

I don't think that being a black belt necessarily makes you invincible, and many people may be better fighters than you. however, a black belt to me is a symbol of excellence. you can be a black belt when you're a white belt, and in everything you do. that's very right. it isn;'t the style it's the fighter. I agree. also, it isn't the rank it's the fighter.

Answer 5

Black Belt has alot of meaning it means you've achieved something to get the black belt.  

Answer 6

Belts mean nothing.

Answer 7

In BJJ it is respect.

Respect that in that even if you catch a BB in a rare instance, you ease up on it so they can escape. You know yourself that you caught them, and that is all that is necessary, no need to crank like a wildman [Eddie Bravo against Hoyler Gracie] as if it were for the ADCC.

E

Answer 8

I'm going to try not to stereotype while answering this question, because not all martial art places do this:  A lot of places, especially ones who claim to be "shao lin" are not really shao lin and only want money.  Obviously, a ten-year-old black belt isn't going to mean much unless that ten-year-old is a gifted genius who pours every ounce of his life into his training...not likely.  Many places, yet not all, only want money.  In my own opinion, the no-belt-systems are the best for training without pride.  Without pride, there is only FRIENDLY rivalries, and without pride, pride can't be hurt.  Simple as so.

As for different styles, as people have mentioned, different techniques could cancel each other out.  Two similar styles like Tai Chi Chuan and Aikido would be very suited to fight each other.  However, Aikido against something like Drunken Monkey Gung Fu, as much an act as a fighting style and always moving, would be very difficult.  In circumstance, Aikido, based on close-range and contact in order to use balance and the opponant's power would do near nothing for a Drunken Monkey, which is based on the trickery (the act, seeming drunk, fake-wobbles, loopey-feints, and glazed eyes) of the Drunken Style and the agility of the Monkey Style, because it would be hard to throw someone off-balance who's entire style is based on that appearance.  Only one example.  Point is, styles can cancel each other out or be completely suitable for each other.

As for the fighter, that's probably the most important part.  A gifted genius of a fighter who has just started his/her training could go up against someone of great rank and win.  Honestly, nobody is "unbeatable", not even the movie stars that people (XP even me...XD)seem to idolize. Then again, someone in the no-belt-system would be completely unidentified to a belt-fighter, bringing the problem of over and under-estimating.  Honestly, there are many variables in who would win in what fight, and each one is extremely important.

Answer 9

Jigoro Kano (Judo- late 1800’s) was the first to introduce the kyu/dan system. Kano started having his yudansha wear black belts in 1886, but despite having kyus and dans he still only used white and black belts. Gichin Funakoshi (Shotokan Karate) picked up this system as a requirement of the Dan-Nippon Butokai before they would recognize Shotokan as a ‘real’ martial art.

Now of course we see it in everything everywhere. It certainly gives people a kind of work/reward system. This apparently is important for some people. Though I personally question their adherence to their professed art if they constantly need outside validation for what is primarily a private experience. On the other hand droves of people signing up for all different kinds of martial schools have kept them alive and well so one nowadays doesn’t have to look much farther than the phone book for whatever kind of school they might be looking for. So if it works for them, I say it’s a fine system indeed.  ÃƒÂ¢Ã‚€Â¦but does it mean black belts can walk on water or break Newton’s laws? Of course not. I’d say that currently it’s more a recognition by your martial peers that you ‘have arrived’. But certainly school to school that varies in it’s value.

--Also those belts don’t hold up my pants very well.

Answer 10

not to be a smartass..but technically black is not a color. it is the opposite of color. white is the absence of color. ironic?

a belt simply shows where you've been, and where you have yet to go.

it says nothing of how "good" you are.  

Answer 11

Black belt basically means you have gone up the martial art ranks, and you have learned and mastered things that beginners have not. Let's take a white belt and a black belt (white is lowest  in Seido Karate). In Seido Karate, a black belt (any kyu) could beat a white belt. The black belt has more experience, and knows more  moves than a white belt. But, an adv. brown belt (1 belt away from black belt) could possibly defeat a black belt, with the right skills. So what you are saying is half right, that black belt is sometimes just a color, and can be beaten by lower belts, but then again, black belts have experience and knowledge in Martial Arts.

Answer 12

Obtaining a black belt doesn't mean you're a superior fighter to all others.  Being a superior fighter also does not mean that you will or even should become a black belt.  McDojo's aside, there are many other considerations that go into being promoted to Shodan.  

I can think of many students I've seen who could enter most tournaments and take home huge trophies for katas, weapons, and sparring, but who also thought they were "all that" and thus, did not have the proper attitude to become a black belt.  Conversely, I know black belts who never compete yet are excellent students and teachers and thus have earned their rank.

Answer 13

A black belt is more than just a color, but it doesnt mean you are a bad *** or that you can beat anyone a lower belt than you.

Fights are won and lost by individuals, not by what style they learned or what color belt they have.

A professional boxer could come into a karate school and start learning karate.  He learns the first form and other requirements and earns his yellow belt.  He may be able to beat up the instructor with his boxing, but he is still just a yellow belt in karate.  The belt color just signifies where he is in his karate training.

James

Answer 14

a black belt is only a color that you wear around your waist. it really doesnt mean that your really good at martial arts, infact you could almost suck. and lower belts could beat black belts any time because of the fact that they are actually better than the black belt. so i agree thet just because someones a black belt doesnt mean that they are really good.

Answer 15

"A black belt is nothing more than a belt that goes around your waist. Being a black belt is a state of mind and attitude." -Rick English. I agree with it %100. I know several yellow belts who have fought and beaten black belts. It is not only the fighter, but also the quality of training they've had. Wearing a black belt won't make you win fights. The only thing it'd good for is holding your pants up.

Answer 16

Color belts is only something that keeps your pants up, no matter the color.

Just becuase your a black belt doesn't mean your one of the best.

Just because your in varsity football doesn't mean your one of the strongest.

Belts only show how long you've been there and how much you know. But YOU are the one who makes the choice to whether you can apply what you know or not.

Answer 17

A Black Belt is a symbol of the highest level of achievement (that's also the definition and meaning of the words, Kung Fu). There are fighters out there that dont know anything about martial arts or could say "WTF is a belt system?" and can still know how to scrap. Its the state of mind the person is in. How open minded he/she is in, how smart and how unrestricting the person is with him/herself in a fight. You don't need to be a black belt to achieve that, it can help you get there since everyone DOESN'T achieve something at the SAME pace. Black Belt also means experience, LOTS of experience. Experience in ACTUAL FIGHTING. Now, you can have a lot of experience in doing Katas and Techniques and Excercises.....but doing them against a live person that moves and hits back is ALOT different than doing those things in the air. My point, and quoting Bruce Lee,"To learn fighting by fighting", hands down, and he doesn't mean pretending. The most anyone else can get better without starting a brawl is to make light contact and controlling simulating fights where you learn how to tak a hit and start to learn what works or not.

Here's some history my GrandMaster told me. Back then, there were NO colored belts like yellow, green, cyan, or pink. There was ONLY a WHITE BELT that was given to you in the beggining of your training. And as the years went by and the countless of Kumite (free fighting of sparring) you encountered and endured, the more your belt darkened from sweat, dirt, and blood. Thats how you got your BLACK BELT!! They wouldn't legitimately call you a black belt by then, they'd just see how dark your belt was and see how much it got worn out cause that is proof on how many fights you've been too in training.

AND, as my favorite belt quote of all time,"Belt only means....no more rope to hold pants up"-Miyagi 1932-2005, RIP

Answer 18

I'd prefer a gold belt!  

Answer 19

Being a black belt should represent your ability in martial arts. It's supposed to mean you've reached maturity in your training, and is the opposite of white, where you're still just a baby.

Unfortunately, sub-standard training and McDojos, etc. have produced a lot of black belts who don't have the skill that they should have. So black belts have become "just a colour" in some cases, but to those of us who train seriously, they still hold a lot of meaning.