Hand of the day XXVI, part 1: a course in garbage hands?

Question

i'm doing this series of hands because i find people confined to structured ways of thinking about the game of poker, and what the "proper" play is that the book tells you...now, i'm challenging all of you guys who answer this question regularly to consider the pros of the route least often taken...also, these questions are not always going to be the normal "do you call the all-in" type of questions; instead, some will focus on bet sizing, and making marginal calls post-flop in deep stack situations

also, take note of the fact that this hand is going to be played in steps...pre-flop, on the flop, on the turn, on the river

part 1 is pre-flop, so it's pretty simple...blinds are 100-200 with no ante early in a big tourney, and both you and utg lead the table with 45k in chips...utg, who has played pretty tight so far, raises to 600 and you have 5-3 of clubs in the cutoff...what do you do?

(the question is really, can anyone point out the right reasons to make a call like this?)

Answer 1

Being the size of our stack, we can afford to make a loose call. A hand like 5 3 suited is a nice hand to bust someones over pair or over cards with. We don't have to be too commited to it to just see a flop. If he plays tight then he at least has a top 10 - 15 starting hand type. But because the size of the raise it's more likely between the top 10 through 15 hands and not so much top 10.

The thing about calling with a hand like 5 3 is you need to be able to let it go if you think your beat, or be prepared to bluff because bluffings will be the best way to take it down. Because 5 3 will not win alot of hands. And not to let yourself get sucked into a hand. For example, with our 5 3 of clubs if the flop comes 5d 6c 2c. We now have a low flush draw and a pair and an inside straight draw. If he leads out and bets we have a good chance of getting sucked in.

So, being that a bluff is the best way to win and not get sucked in and lose all our chips, instead of a call if I was planning to take the pot down later I'd raise the minimum of 600 to 1200 total. If he just calls we now know it's not a monster (top 3ish) hand. And depending on the flop (and table image) we would be able to bet and represent a better hand to take it down with a bluff rather than if we just called. If a fairly low flop comes up we're probably golden with a bet because if he's tight, and he doesn't have anything he folds. If he bets or calls in any way he's way ahead and we can shut it down and wait for a better time.

Answer 2

i dunno. the only reason to not fold this hand is if you are playing manic aggressive style, and even then everything is not in your favor. You want to act first after the flop, and this is about the worst place to be. even raising does not guarantee the advantage of first in virgorish.

if you are planning to play this hand, the only thing to do is get a fold preflop, so raise to 6000. if somebody behind you calls, you need the UTG to fold to make this hand playable.

if you are first to act after the flop, put up a standard continuation bet and then throw it away if anybody calls/raises.

oops, sorry, didn't answer the the question:

Reasons why someone should call this:

1. temporary insanity

2. permanent insanity

3. position on the UTG: however, assuming that the UTG made the raise with Ax, the you have to hope that the flop is 10 and lower to have a chance to take it away.

4. the UTG is insane

Answer 3

3 5 suited...i would fold.  I can't think of a reason for why I would call a raise with that hand...even if I am in late position.