Have environmentalists hurt national security? Sonar is now banned off the CA coast?

Question

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080205/ap_on_re_us/navy_sonar;_ylt=AijWJMzZTidvh3vMX_EsHbms0NUE

How can you detect an enemy sub if you're under orders from a federal judge not to use sonar, because it hurts the whales?

Answer 1

Yes it hurts National Security.

Going active on sonar is not just press a button, send out a ping and oh, their is the bad guy! It is ALLOT more complicated than that, especially when he is trying to evade you. Using Active Sonar can only be praticed in real world scenarios, no trainer can do this. It is an art if not practiced with live targets, it is not mastered.

Yes passive is used nearly all the time, but the US still spends millions of dollars a year into Active sonar for a reason! It is still an effective tool, that is required in the Navy to find and kill submarines.

I'm not completeley buying that Active does harm anyhow, unless they happen to be at an extremeley close range (which we stop transmitting anyways). "Bleeding" from certain areas is hardly proof, since overcompression (diving to deep) or surfacing to quick can cause the exact same syptoms. Beacuse you can hear sound a long way off hardly means c**p to how loud it is. How far you can hear sound is not so much a factor on source level (though it is part of it) as much as it is on proploss caused by the environent. Most of the sound energy is lost in the first 1000 yds, and loss from that point on gradully decreases in typical deep water environments. But all that, well I can go into proploss for a while, but won't. But end result, even at max power to cause damage to anylife form they would need to be extrodinarily close, beyond that it is just really loud, and further out is just noise until diminishing into the background.

If we (sumarines) are so dangerous to them, why do whales porposises, and dolphins follow us for up to days, even after we go active?

Answer 2

they have not hurt national security.

The navy can still use its passive sonar in which they don't emit sound just listen for it.  The use of active sonar is mostly used in naval exercises its not like the navy really needs to blast the ocean with sound during the exercises they can use their simulators or move their active sonar into waters that have fewer whales.   For those who think active sonar doesn't hurt whales then explain why they have been beaching with burst ear drums.  The sonars are extremely loud and water carries sound great distances.  If you have ever been around when the sonar is used you'll know how loud they are even out of the water and its not like the whales can escape the noise.  Physics show how damaging loud sounds can be in the water the same principle of sound waves going through water is the same principles as other waves can go through water and is the reason a sunami can start on one side of the ocean from a landslide into the ocean and reach countries thousands of miles away on the otherside.

Answer 3

The navy subs use passive sonar 99% of the time, this emits no noise or sounds, it just listens.  To use sonar would be like trying to sneak up on someone in the dark with your flash light on.