Have "Basset Hounds" been improved by breeders sanctioned by the Kennel Club ?

Question

Basset Hounds from an 1895 issue of The Illustrated London News

http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh273/sporadic23/FBILN951/FBILN952/P4120599.jpg?t=1219774430

CH Bromwylva Imperial Mint at Dereheath - Top Basset Hound 2004

http://www.bayingbasset.com/clientpics/mintymidlands.jpg

I know what I think.

Answer 1

Improved... although I don't know that the kennel club "sanctions" anyone.

Gotta say.. BassetNut's answer is spot on.  One of the most brilliant answers I've seen here.

Answer 2

'In my opinion' with what I have seen and experienced as a dog lover and owner,  there are very few dogs that have been improved by our meddling, I believe we have gone for atheistic value first and health second in most breeds. I have 2 14 stone Newfoundland dogs and they are way too large these days which causes them all sorts of problems, heart, joints etc, we need to stop going for what we think looks good and think more on what is healthy for the dog.

Answer 3

what can i say that's what happens when you force fathers and daughters to breed.

you wouldn't do it in humans because of the obvious side affects.

they look hideous.

Answer 4

I have never seen a Basset with a respiratory problem, and I'm not sure how jowls could cause one -- it is the length of the muzzle and the shape of the skull that create respiratory problems...the modern Basset isn't lacking in either department (and no scenthound should be!).

As for the "fat" that "rubs the ground", I think you're thinking of the skin folds, which help collect scent. I have yet to see a Basset with so much skin that it touches the ground...and since my Dachshunds typically show in the same ring, I cross paths with the Bassets quite often!

In terms of general proportion and size, I see relatively little difference between the drawing and the photo -- they are easily identified as the same breed. The dogs in the drawing are more refined, and the skin folds are less apparent, but that -- much like the prominent illustration of the nipples on the b*tches -- may be attributed to artistic license!

ADD: Wow, Basset -- awesome illustrations! Thank you for digging those up!

It looks like -- at least in terms of structure -- the modern Basset Hound has come a long way.

ADD:

Re: Glaucoma -- A genetic eye disease caused by shallow drainage angles in the eye. It can be tested for prior to breeding, and eliminated from a breeding program.

Re: Otitis externa -- Outer ear infections occur in nearly every drop-eared dog, purebred or not. When the ear flap covers the ear canal, a moist, humid environment can occur....

Re: vWD -- Again, something easily tested for and removed from a breeding program. Even puppies can be tested for this one.

Re: Propensity to Obesity -- Oh, come on. Really? You're going to blame breeders for people overfeeding and not getting off their butts to walk their dog?

Another trait of *many* dogs, purebred and mixed. As well as many people.

Answer 5

To me, they are visually more appealing now. I don't think the changes made over the last 110 years are better for the individual dog though. It looks as though their backs are longer and legs shorter, which can cause certain back problems. Look how much English Bulldogs have changed. There's a list of health problems that breed now has due to the changes people encouraged in breeding them.

ADD: To my knowledge, Basset Hounds do not have respiratory problems.

Answer 6

http://vets.tv/video.php?vid=115&cid=

This explains it all. If you listen to the end, (It's 10 minutes) it explains that the UKC is trying to discourage breeders from breeding dogs with problems!

Answer 7

Although I take your point about photography pre-1900, do you have any other photos of basset hounds, perhaps more recently than the turn of the century, recent enough for decent photographs but "old enough" that there was a noticeable difference between today's basset and that of 19XX?

BTW: I've seen no evidence of respiratory problems in the basset. Could you point me towards some please?

Answer 8

I truly do not want to get into this argument because it's clearly pointless, but suffice to say Bassets of the past, of which this is one picture, were often very far from sound and many of the problems breeders are faced with today result from faults that are still coming out all these years later.  The complaint by some about Bassets today relate, as I understand it, to length of back, length of ear and lowness to the ground.  The early bassets had equally long backs and were equally low to the ground (as shown in the picture)   They have longer ears today.  So what!!  They trip over them - what rubbish!  At no point since 1972 have any of mine needed vet treatment for long ears. Truly.

This is and always was a man made breed bred for a specific purpose and much as the purpose for which the breed was bred is no longer (officially) available to the breed (UK), it is my belief that over the intervening years, most breeders have, and still are, striving to improve generation on generation.

I do believe that today's basset, as seen in the ring (but not this example shown here), is often overdone in terms of excess skin and weight, but with the exception of bloat and some epilepsy, probably due to the outcrossing with Bloodhounds? generally speaking this breed remains free of anything that is inheritantly life-threatening and we are not all breeding for this overly furnished animal.  And to believe this, based on what? is totally false.

Sanctioned by the KC - not sure what that means.  But before I get dumped on for not answering the question - I believe that overall today's basset is an improvement over what was seen in the early 1900s, whether breeders are sanctioned by the KC, or not.

Just saw - respiratory problems?  Huh?

Add - thanks for taking the time to add the links B.  Well done.

Answer 9

Well, an artist's rendition can differ greatly from the subjects.  You have to realize that every breed has been altered since its beginning.  The Dobermann is thought to have been a mix of Greyhound, Rottweiler, Great Dane, and many other breeds.  What we are looking at here, is assisted natural selection in different formats.  On one hand, reputable breeders are trying to keep the essence of the hound alive by passing on traits from individuals that have qualities becoming of the breed.  Dogs with excellent scent finding abilities are more likely to be bred than those who can't find the treat in the "which cup is hiding the treat" game.

The other part of this is irresponsible breeders (puppy farmers) who try to play on the heartstrings of humans.  Who can resist such a cute puppy face like that of the basset hound?  They try to make money off of quick sales.

You may want to stop debating whether or not breeds have changed in the past 200 years, because all of them have, and there isn't much we can do about it!

Answer 10

Bassets have respiratory problems - where did you find that?

Floppy d**k - if you didn't want 14 stone Newfoundlands why didn't you buy dogs bred within the standard of 10 to 11 stone?

Answer 11

Perhaps you have an actual photo of an early basset, rather than an artist's impression?

BRB, collecting links....

Oh, while I'm at it, what exactly do you find objectionable about the modern Basset Hound?

Keep in mind that until 1892, the Basset Hound breed did not actually exist.  The breed in question was the Basset Artesien Normand.  Although there had been earlier Beagle crosses, largely deemed unsuccessful, in 1892 there were crosses with the Bloodhound, to improve size and type, and the modern day Basset Hound was created.

As noted, the early bassets had plenty of skin.  As you can see in the lower picture, many of them had extremely unsound legs. http://basset.net/balogh-link7.html

Or how about this early Basset?  As you can see, she is quite heavy and loose-skinned, but again quite unsound in the legs and shoulders.

http://basset.net/balogh-link6.html

One of the earliest Bassets, Model

http://basset.net/balogh-links3-4.html

Unsoundness in the hind end.  Considered an excellent Basset for the time, but "rather flat in skull and having badly hung ears".

These Bassets are from the time of Queen Alexandra, in the 1880s.  Do they look a lot different from today's Bassets?

http://basset.net/balogh-link9.html

The Walhampton pack from 1910.  Note the extremely bad fronts

http://basset.net/balogh-link11.html

Two early imports from England to America

http://basset.net/balogh-link12.html

Note the steep shoulders, short upper arms, straight stifles and extremely high rears.  Note too that the head on the male is very similar to what you'd find today.

Compare this with today's show bassets:

Here's a recent top-winning b*tch, Ch Topsfield-Vision Silver Noodles.  Look at the beautiful shoulder and legs, the nice level topline.  This is a lovely, sound animal that could hunt all day.

http://www.topsfieldbassets.com/Topsfiel...

How about three time National Specialty winner, Ch Foxglen Special Forces?

http://www.basset-bhca.org/Events/2007_N...

If a Basset has rolls of fat that are rubbing the ground, then it is either overfed or incorrect.  I've had Bassets for 30 years, and NONE have had ANY respiratory issues.  And they've been quite healthy, thank you, despite being show champions and from a long line of show dogs.  

My dogs also compete in obedience, agility and rally, not something they could do if they were unhealthy, unsound, unfit, or temperamentally deficient.

Sally, competing last October at age 9 1/2

http://photos.imageevent.com/freenite/mi...

http://photos.imageevent.com/freenite/mi...

http://photos.imageevent.com/freenite/mi...

She just earned her Rally Novice title this past weekend, placing first in her class. Not bad for 10 years old!

Here's Rosie, at age 6

http://photos.imageevent.com/freenite/mi...

http://photos.imageevent.com/freenite/mi...

http://photos.imageevent.com/freenite/mi...

Both these dogs are also show champions.

EDIT: >>>glaucoma, otitis externa, Von Willebrand's disease and a propensity to obesity.<<<

Glaucoma is an issue in some lines, which is why a gonioscopy is recommended by the parent club.  However, while I know several BYB/puppymill Bassets with Glaucoma, I only of one show dog with this issue.  Not saying that there aren't more, but these are specific dogs that I know of.  In the case of the show dog, the breeders were immediately trying to track down the dog that was the source of the problem, so as not to breed any more such animals.  However, I know at least one BYB that was breeding her glaucoma b*tch and saw nothing wrong with that.

Propensity to obesity has more to do with the type of people who buy Basset Hounds, as they tend to be purchased by pet owners who want a sedentary couch-potato.  As you can see, my dogs are not obese.

Otitis externa means ear infection.  A common problem in ALL breeds of dogs.  People too.  And yes, as a groomer I've seen even pr*ck-eared dogs with ear infections.

It is recommended by the parent club that Bassets be tested for vWD, however I have never heard of an actual case.

Keep in mind that in the past 30 years I've met hundreds if not thousands of Basset Hounds.