Help with bit and horse with her head down??

Question

My horse is constantly puttin her head down when I ride her. It is fine at first, but then it gets too low and is just very awkward and forces me to be constantly tryin to pull it back up. I think it's the bit, she is constantly chewin on it and playin with it while I ride her. When I bridle her she has no problem acceptin the bit. She is currently being ridden in a loose ring snaffle, but I'm wondeirn if changin the bit to something else will help to raise her head and concentrate more on me then the bit. Or if it's not the bit, do you know any reason as to why her head is so low (she is not tryin to buck me off, I know that) and ways to help fix it??

Thanks in advance :]

Answer 1

A Gag bit should lift her head

Answer 2

Provided that her bit is fitted properly, and her teeth are in good shape, I suggest that you work on encouraging forward impulsion.  Use your seat (pelvis) to deepen into the saddle and thrust your weight forward with her forward movement, while using leg pressure to drive her hindquarters under her and make her reach forward with her legs.  Once you can feel her back elevating, you will also see her forehand lifting, and her head will come up into balance as you use light rein cues to maintain her in her gait.  This is called collection and it is the proper way for your horse to move under saddle.

If you use any shanked bit when you do this you will only make your problems worse, and you won't achieve the true collection that will benefit everything you do with your horse, and will make your horse into a better athlete/performer.

Answer 3

First I would like to complement you riding in a D-ring, great choice I wish more poepl would use it! Definatly syick with it. As long as she is listening, and not acting up lowering her head is a sign of softness. When her head is below her withers it means she is supple. You could try some flexing excersises to help her loosen up further.

Hope this helps! Again great chocie in bit, and i dont think its a big problem as long as its not affecting her work.

Answer 4

I suggest using a tom thumb bit. It is split in the middle like a snaffle but does not have the rings at the corners of the mouth like a snaffle--there are bar-like things on the outside of the bit that connect to the headstall and reins. Tom thumb bits aren't as soft on the mouth as a snaffle and not as harsh as a curb. I use a curb on my horse because we barrel race and he is NOT light on the mouth at all; a tom thumb bit was too light for him so we had to kick it up a notch. Try a tom thumb, and if that doesn't work then use a curb.

Answer 5

i would take her out of the loose ring, and put in a D ring or full cheek.., also, although its not as "nice" as a french link (if that's what your using..) i would put her in a regular snaffle as it will discourage the head bobbing/head dropping..

second, when she puts her head down just ignore it, push her fore ward and just let her do it (so as soon as it goes down, add leg and keep squeezing, release if she brings her head up)  .. eventually she'll get bored of it and decide to pay attention.  You can also try "fiddling" your reins a bit when she drops, just playing, half halting, making the bit move a bit so that she feels it.

very add situation though..

good luck!

and what "born eventer" is saying does make sense.  Her confomation has NOTHING to due with her head droping, unless she walks around like that ALL THE TIME (which even the western pleasure horses don't do)

there are PLENTY of JC regestired PURE TB's that do WONDERFULLY in all areas of riding, western and english, eventing and hunters, and they don't need "welsh pony blood" to make them better

here, full TB with wonderful neck carrige/collection

http://www.waltzinghorses.com/salehorsep...

http://www.cyberhorse.net.au/tve/dressag...

no pony needed.

Answer 6

No - it's got nothing to do with her having been rested.  Chomping at the bit - putting her head down low, up high, chin way behind the bit, nose way out, tongue sticking out, etc - basically anything other than a natural (proper) headset and a quite mouth are usually signs of bit resistance - at some point with the bit in her mouth, it's uncomfortable to her - some are fine as rest, but when engaged, they resist.  All this resistance contributes to lack of focus, so decreased training improvements.

Here's an analogy for how bit works that will help you understand what's taking place in her mouth so you can understand why she'd going what she's doing.

The snaffle bit is a jointed two part bit typically allowed somehow to function independently from the cheekpieces - the rings slide around ina loose ring snaffe, on a dee ring the mouthpieces aren't jointed where they meet the cheek piece but the cheekpiece itself is jointer to allow you to pull out on a rein.

When pressure is applied to this device in a backward motion, you create two things - a pinch and a jab.  The two pieces are pulled together pinching the tongue between them - the force of the pinch varies greatly with the force of the pull.  Also, the resulting point that is created from the two parts coming toward each other from the backward pressure creates a bit of a point - when you pull up and back, the point is driven into the tongue of the horse - this creates a strong gag.  If you'll take your finger and place it in the middle of your tongue as far as you can and press down as with differing degress of pressure, then try to walk, about, you'll have a pretty close feel for what the horse feels with a typical snaffle bit in their mouths.  Keep in mind, although this sounds like torture and it often can be so in incorrect hands, the horse's tongue is pretty strong so it's probably not quite as bad as your finger in your mouth - but you get the idea.

The snaffle bit is designed to get quick attention of the horse by taking his tongue away, causing a gag that gets it's attention.  Quite often, with direct reins such as snaffle bits require and a loose ring, you are constantly putting pressure on the bit causing pinch and gag - especially if your hands are too heavy.

Additionally the loose rings allow your reins to slip up to the headstall and the rings slide around so you have no true leverage - the control becomes the pulll that becomes increasing harder as she's resisting.

Can you get the "feel" yourself while reading this of what your horse is experienceing?  She's uncomfortable and trying to find a comfortable spot with the bit.

My suggestion is to try a Myler Comfort Snaffle.  These bits have a few differences that allow them to communicate the same way as a true snaffle, but perhaps a little more humanely to reinforce a message but not hurt.  another thing to remember is that when a horse feels trapped (which it will if you're causing it to gag), it will not feel confident - you have taken away it's flight ability so it may react hazardously if it feels too trapped - violent head tossing etc.

The Comfort Snaffle has two mouth pieces which are curved a small amount to allow the horse to move their tongue a little - you cannot completely gag the heck out of them.  They are made of sweet iron or stainless steel with copper inlays - copper keeps the mouth moist (it encourages salivation with it's sweet taste) yet copper is soft metal so quite often full copper mouths can get chewed up or bitten and have some sharp, uncomfortable nics in them - the inlays still have a sweet taste but the bit cannot be nicked to create hurting points.

These two big pieces are joined by a type of roller - either a stainless roller or a stainless and copper roller - this further encourages salivation and further assists them moving their tongue.  

Finally, the two mountpieces move independently of each other, you can swivel the left side while holding the right side completely still, which you can't do with a two-piece bit.  This allows you to move one rein or the other to correct a dropped shoulder, etc.

The mouthpiece comes in numerous different cheeks - loose ring, D ring, D Ring with hooks (to increase leverage), full short shanks and long shanks.

When I moved my mare from a standard D ring snaffle to my Myler, the difference was as night to day.

Go to mylerbitsusa.com to see all sorts of information about the bits - you may be able to request a DVD as well.  The book and DVDs are available at many tack stores for around $20 - and watching the DVD THEN referring to the book with teach you much about bit technology.  I have found though for myself and others that reading the book first doesn't cut it - watch the DVD and then keep the book as a pocket reference.  They'll be well worth the money in the knowledge you will gain and understanding in how your horse perceives the fit of the bit and how it feels to her.

Finally - these bits aren't cheap - but they're well worth their cost - they hold their value well and more and more stores tack part in the Myler rental program which allows you to try basic bit types to determinet he proper one for your particular need.

I hope this helps. Good luck!

Answer 7

id say get a dutch gag and put it on the first ring (the big one) it looks like this http://www.eclipse-equestrian.com/acatal...

it will give a very slight poll action without being harsh as she wouldnt need anything more than a snaffle really but this will help her bring her head up.

HOWEVER, a bit is not always a solution and if you do change it, dont have anything harsh becuse she doesnt need it.

Perhaps you are "heavy handed" in which case she is putting her head down to try and get away from you constantly pulling on her mouth.

Maybe her bridle is not fitting properly, it maybe fixed to wide for her or too low in which case get someone who knows what theyre talking about to fit it.

It could even be a vice - an evasion of the bit, does she do it when you try to stop her or when your giving an aid etc...

EDIT:

well TB's arnt known for their head confirmation which is why they are better crossed with Welsh's.

The welsh gives them the lovely rounded topline but still carry the agility of the TB.

perhaps you are just asking her to carry her head crested and she finds it uncomfortable so snatches the bit.

I know from expirence that you cannot change a horses confirmation - they are born like it and that is what you get.

Answer 8

Whats happening here by the sounds of things is one of two things - 1.  She is asking for more OR she is avoiding contact or 2. She might need her teeth floated.  If she doesnt need her teeth done, Iam going to suggest its 1. She is asking for more or 2. She is avoiding contact.  So how to solve both ?  Push her forward when she leans down to far.  Push "into the bit" so to speak.  When you ask for a little more empulsion when this happens, you'll notice her head will come up.  Reward her with an inside pat and continue to school her.  I dont think its the bit, but a bit change could possibly help, it depends and its hard to say.  I have an off track TB who Iam working with who is "hard in the mouth" and has the same tendancy to LEAN to much into my hand (She is avoiding the contact).  If I push her forward, into the bit, she comes up and into my hand nicely and finds a comfort zone there. Once she feels comfortable there she starts to accept the contact a little more each time. Try it :) Otherwise, definatley consult your coach and solve the problem.  Otherwise you're going to have a fight, an uncomfortable horse AND really musclar biceps hehe

Good Luck :)

EDIT**

After being off, it might have something little to do with it.  Trying to compensate her balance by avoiding the contact.  It makes sense thats for sure!  Just take it slow with her, work on long and low and then slowly pick up the empulsion and work on getting her back into your hand.  Its just consistency and patience. :)

EDIT**

I have to comment and say that Im just about 99.9% positive it has absolutley nothing to do with her confirmation.  Her head confirmation has nothing to do with it by the sounds of things, this is simply a greenie/balance issue we're having.  And TBs are actually well known for their head confirmation - they are used to cross for their finer bone structutre and doll heads.  Necks, not so much and not known for spectacular movement BUT without seeing a photos of this mare...we cant make assumptions on confirmation which in the end would play ZERO effect on balance and ability to collect and ride soft.

Answer 9

some breeds of horse are expected to carry their head lower to the ground such as quarter horses and stock breeds if the horse isnt trying to buck this may be a sign that she is comfortable

Answer 10

How long has she been back in work? This particular situation and her behavior doesn't sound like bit evasion to me. It sounds like she is reaching long and low, working the bit, to stretch her topline and back muscles. If she's been out of work for 10 months, let her stretch as you get her back into shape. It's hard work for her and it's great if she is trying to loosen her back up by stretching low. When she does this, don't play tug of war with her. Sit deep and tall, push-push for about 2 beats with your inside calves, and ask for some extension. You should feel her back coming up under you. Now if she starts bopping her head up and down or jerking the reins out of your hands and then putting her head back up immediately - that's evasion. Chewing on the bit while going low is a good thing. Do your own research and you'll see (dressage). Try not to rush things ;-)

ADD: Check this out: http://www.webpeak.com/~tony/dressage/lo...

You can really make this work to your advantage! Please, don't use a gag on her. Imagine going to the dr. and having him press down activating your gag reflex and not letting up. That's exactly what a gag bit does.