How pratical are hydrogen fuel cell vechicles?

Question

If a majority of our automobiles were replaced with vehicles which operate on hydrogen powered fuel cells, how could massive amounts of hydrogen be stored safely for refueling? How safe are these cars when the fuel tank ruptures due to collision compared to current gasoline/diesel ones currently in use? How many miles will the vehicles be able to go before refueling?

Answer 1

Have you considered the engineering behind methanol fuel cells?  Methanol, CH3OH + H2O= by-product is water  and CO2.  Possible, recycling of these components over a catalyst could create a steady-state fuel cell, the chemical equivalent of a Sterling engine?

Methanol is the simplest alcohol, explains Virginia Tech chemistry professor James McGrath. When used as fuel, it is diluted with water. In the fuel cell, the methanol-water molecule is stripped of an electron -- the energy source -- then the water and proton cross the proton exchange membrane to the fuel cell's second chamber, where carbon dioxide and water are created as byproducts.

Answer 2

If I was the greedy CEO of Exxon/Mobil and had nothing but contempt for the economy, the environment and national security, I'd lobby the government very hard to invest in the red-herring of hydrogen.  I'd know that the energy needed to produce H2 would have to come from somewhere, and as we all know, we're used to consuming lots of oil.

With the inefficiencies of H2 production combined with the inefficiencies of fuel cells, I would not have to worry about reduced oil consumption.  Also I'd make sure that I control the world's limited supply of platinum for making fuel cells.  I also know that it would take at least 20 years to change our entire fuel delivery infrastructure so I wouldn't have to change anything too quickly.

What I would discourage is the development of alternative SOURCES of energy as well as better ways of storing energy such as Lithium-polymer batteries.  That stuff would scare me because I might have to take my $Billion retirement bonus go live in Fiji.

Answer 3

Hyrogren is unique in that it's main byproduct is water.

Thus, a hydrogen fuel cell should be able to be made which more or less recycles itelf.  One doesn't need to store massive amounts of hydrogen.  

The problem is getting them efficient enough.  We'd like to see them working for electric plants, also, but the problem is getting them to produce enough hydrogen for the incredible amount of electricty modern life demands.

Safety isn't a great issue with hydrogen.  We're not talking bombs here.  

But more work needs to be done before they are practicable on a large scale.

Something we forget in America is that a lot of countries don't need the enormous amounts of fuel we do, being smaller, and having a greater variety of transportation available.  

Iceland is in the forefront of this movement.  And it works well for them in busses.  Personally, I'm all for it if it can be worked out.  Right now I drive  Honda Civic Hybrid.

Maggie

Answer 4

Let's think outside the box for a moment shall we?  You don't specify the form that the hydrogen needs to stored in to use this system.  How about we assume hydrogen is created by combining to perfectly stable elements in a catalyzing method to generate the hydrogen.  

Then we don't have to worry about storage safety.  These cars would then be perfectly safe if there is a rupture in the tank because we have two stable catalyst agents and we only have to worry about making sure they don't combine.

Miles before refueling is of course determined by how much fuel we have in the vehicle.  The only limiting parameters would be storage weight and bulk of the fuel in relation to the vehicle, so we could theoretically have a vehicle go thousands of miles before refueling.

I'm not saying this will be the system that is created, I'm just saying it's possible as we learn to develop new technologies.  Let's think BIG!

Answer 5

not very, hydrogen plants would be better cause drunk drivers can't drive them

Answer 6

Never happen. Too many to's. To unsafe. To impractical. To many dummies that couldn't safely refill their cars. To costly. To many unwilling to change. To dangerous. To expensive. To unreliable. To few companies willing to spend money to perfect something that might not sell. To imperfect. To stupid of an idea. To risky. To many dummies. To few tanker trucks. To much to convert to. To few adherents. To few advocates. To much risk. To few investors. To little backing. To costly to produce hydrogen. To much energy to produce hydrogen=no benefits or cost savings. To few engines run on hydrogen. To little horsepower and torque. To unsure. To much to insure. To + to=0.

Answer 7

Hydrogen is like electricity, once you have it, It's great. It will power whatever you want. The question remains, where is the hydrogen (electricity) to come from. The amount of energy it takes to seperate the hydrogen from anything is way more than the hydrogen energy is worth. Listen to the first hour of www.financialsense.com last Saturday (5-26) show for a discussion of the relative cost of ethanol versus diesel. Desiel wins hands down. If we can go desiel-electric hybrid, we won't need to build any new oil refineries! Europe is going desiel. Listen to how ethanol won't go through pipe lines. How will you deliver it? We have very few ethanol enabled stations versus lots of stations that could sell biodesiel. Factoid: Otto Desiel who invented the desiel engine always intended it to run on vegetable oil. Listen and learn.

Answer 8

Essentially not practical at all using current technology.

That doesn't mean they can never become practical...  It just means that we need to learn better ways to make them efficient and to bring their production costs down.

Answer 9

Although they are not expected to reach the mass market before 2010, fuel cell vehicles (FCVs) may someday revolutionize on-road transportation.

This emerging technology has the potential to significantly reduce energy use and harmful emissions, as well as our dependence on foreign oil. FCVs will have other benefits as well.

A Radical Departure

FCVs represent a radical departure from vehicles with conventional internal combustion engines. Like battery-electric vehicles, FCVs are propelled by electric motors. But while battery electric vehicles use electricity from an external source (and store it in a battery), FCVs create their own electricity. Fuel cells onboard the vehicle create electricity through a chemical process using hydrogen fuel and oxygen from the air.

FCVs can be fueled with pure hydrogen gas stored onboard in high-pressure tanks. They also can be fueled with hydrogen-rich fuels; such as methanol, natural gas, or even gasoline; but these fuels must first be converted into hydrogen gas by an onboard device called a "reformer."

FCVs fueled with pure hydrogen emit no pollutants; only water and heat; while those using hydrogen-rich fuels and a reformer produce only small amounts of air pollutants. In addition, FCVs can be twice as efficient as similarly sized conventional vehicles and may also incorporate other advanced technologies to increase efficiency.

Meeting Challenges Together

Before FCVs make it to your local auto dealer, significant research and development is required to reduce cost and improve performance. We must also find effective and efficient ways to produce and store hydrogen and other fuels.

Automakers, fuel cell developers, component suppliers, government agencies, and others are working hard to accelerate the introduction of FCVs. Partnerships such as the DOE-led FreedomCAR initiative and the California Fuel Cell Partnership have been formed to encourage private companies and government agencies to work together to move these vehicles toward commercialization.

FreedomCAR

FreedomCAR is a new cooperative research effort between the DOE and the U.S. Council for Automotive Research (Ford, General Motors, and DaimlerChrysler) formed to promote research into advanced automotive technologies, such as FCVs, that may dramatically reduce oil consumption and environmental impacts. FreedomCAR's goal is the development of cars and trucks that are:

Cheaper to operate

Pollution-free

Competitively priced

Free from imported oil

California Fuel Cell Partnership (CaFCP)

The California Fuel Cell Partnership is a collaboration of auto companies, fuel providers, fuel cell technology companies, and government agencies demonstrating fuel cell electric vehicles in California under day-to-day driving conditions. The goals of the partnership are to test and demonstrate the viability of FCVs and related technology under real-world conditions, move them toward commercialization, and increase public awareness. The Partnership expects to place about 60 FCVs and fuel cell buses on the road by 2003.

Answer 10

They are working on it!

And I don`t think they will be like the "Hindenburg".

Answer 11

Hydrogen, even as a liquid, just isn't dense enough to be able to carry much, so range sucks. Right now you can carry more energy in a battery than you can in a hydrogen tank. Gasoline and diesel are very efficient fuels when you need a lot of range and quick refueling. Liquefied natural gas sometimes makes sense.They pack a lot of power per cubic foot and per pound, and we've learned to deal with the fire hazards.Hybrids make that more efficient unless you're doing a lot of constant high-speed transport. For shorter range or stop and go, hybrids can act as pure electrics, putting the burden of clean burning or non-fuel sources on the electric supply. We seem to be advancing battery storage, sometimes in ways that are moving hydrogen around, faster than we are advancing hydrogen storage. Fossil fuel is an extremely efficient and easy way to carry energy around. We just don't need to waste near as much of it as we do.

Answer 12

Look at the Hindenberg explosion.

No, no, really.  Look closer.  

Nobody got burned by the hydrogen fire, which was going straight up.  Because hydrogen is lighter than air, and wants to go up.

The gondola was on the bottom, and most people survived.

However, the hydrogen set gasoline on fire (the Hindenberg carried gasoline to run the engines).  Gasoline does what it does, flow all over the ground in great big puddles of flame. Many people suffered burns from the gasoline.