I'm a Saudi woman wanting to marry with a non-Saudi...please help?

Question

and thank you Andree, you are absolutely right :)

Answer 1

as long they said no that means no broke up with him and idont think there is something called love before marrjed in islmaic ? dont u iagaree with me ?

يعنى شي اسمه علاقه قبل الزواج اقولك من الحين زواج بااااااااااطل وشلون كلمتى اهلك بالموضووع هذا وقلت انه انت تحبينه ؟  ÃƒÂ™Ã‚‚سم بالله لو انك اختى واسمع الكلام هذا منك لادفنك دفن  ÃƒÂ˜Ã‚¹Ã™Â„ى العموم تزوجيه وشوفي النتيجه انه انسان جايك مشان ماااااااده فقط وانت حره واهلك الحمدالله انهم اعترضوا على الزواج لكن فكره علاقه حب قبل الزواج فاشله وبس

Answer 2

so what is the matter???

you both in love in the name of Allah..

tell your parents that Allah see people not from their race, their nasab, their money and even their look.

what the matter is takwa..

tell your parents about bilal, he is a former slave but he got married with a quraisyi woman that in the eyes of the people have higher degree in the society

tell your parents about zaid bin haritsah too, who also a former slave that nikah to bint jahsi

tell your parents about uthman bin affan from umayyad clan who got married with two of the Rasulullah's daughters from hasyim clan

so, it's not about saudis or lebanese or egyptian or anything

it's about he is a muslim or not

i wish you have a good luck, Insya Allah

Answer 3

have you actually met this man? or is this an internet or phone relationship?...

you say he is your "lover"(meaning one you have made love to?)... is this also a reason why your father is opposed?.. Anyways.. you didnt elaborate on to what extent your relationship is .

If you are determined.. this is a choice you will have to think about cause changing it or backing out later will also bring hardship to you.. Your children will not be recognized as Saudi citizens you know this? my sister in law (saudi lady) married a Qatari man and the saudi government does not recognize her children as saudi.. even though she the mother is.. They now live in Qatar... Maybe you can live in Bahrain or Dubai, Qatar.. they are all still close enough where possibly your relatives could visit, but wouldnt cause hardship to you and your husband...

Answer 4

Welcome to the Dark Ages and 700AD.

On your next family trip out of the country arrange to have your boy friend there too.  The two of you get on a plane and fly away to some civilized country and start your life.  Once there you will have many opportunities to make money and live unrestricted enjoying life.

When I was twenty three my girlfriend tilted me because her parents did not approve of me. . . For their own biased reasons.  I hopped on a plane and flew many continents away from there never to return. . .having burned all the bridges behind me.  Since then I have never looked back except to realize how narrow and confined my life would have been had I stayed.

Look at my profile, fancy that!  I have become very independent and enjoy a carefree life being happily married and away from meddling restrictive parents and social codes.  

If you don't go with your heart, you will suffer and always look back and be unhappy. . .for what?  Oh to please some other people who will not feel your pain.  Break lose and smell the flowers.!.!

Answer 5

i am not so expert in these issues as my society is so conservative and mixed marriages are really rare. but i sympathize with you, so here is what i would do:

1.insist on your will.

2.ask one of your relatives to help talk to your parents.

3.contact one of the committees that deal with family disputes. usually a judge.

4.contact human rights committee.

5.if you do all these steps and still cannot marry your lover, then do not marry him. never get married in secret or in exile.

remember you will have kids and your choices will make their lives.

i wish you marry your lover in peace.

Answer 6

I agree with what Just Me said in English.  Unfortunately my Arabic isn't good enough yet to read the Arabic responses.

I am an American woman married to a Saudi man.  We faced a lot of resistance from my husband's family.  My husband married me without telling his family.  He told them after we were married for 2-3 months when he went home for a visit because he didn't wanna tell them over the phone.  Now that I am in Saudi Arabia, the family is happy (well, maybe not happy, but accepting..)

I think it would be best if you have the support of your family and his family.  It will make everything much easier for your future.  Your 'lover' needs to meet your father at least before you get married.  I don't think it's a good idea to run off and get married secretly in another country.  How will you be able to live in KSA?  Do you think the gov't will approve your marriage even with your father's approval?  It's very difficult just to get the marriage approved for a saudi man married to a non-saudi.  I can't imagine the other way around....The gov't will do everything they can to not approve it.  And, as others said, your kids won't be Saudi.  They will have to apply for Saudi citizenship after they're adults.

Marriage is not easy, even if you have the support of your parents.  Make sure you really love him.  I agree that maybe you should take a break from talking to him for a while to see how you really feel and so you can think more clearly.  Also, pray istikharah during this break.  

Since one of your parents is not Saudi, do you have another passport that's not Saudi?  If you do, I guess that's one way that your marriage could be recognized legally???

Answer 7

يابنت الناس اللبنانى بياع كلام ولايهمك هو رجال شكله عندي مشروع ولا يبي الجنسيه وانت الضحيه وانا ماقول الكلام هذا الا من صالحك واهلك ادراء في مصلحتك ولا تسوين مسلسل مكسيكى انا احبه وهو يحبنى الله يبرزقك بواحد بن حلال وتحبينه طووول عمرك وش لك في اللبنانى ياكثر الشباب الي طايحين بدون وظايف يبون يتزوجون اذا كنت بنت عنده ماااااده بدال ماتصرفينه على اللبنانى اصرفيها على زوجك سعودي وهذا والله ماجاء وقالك الكلام هذا الا انه يبي شي معين منك وسلام

Answer 8

May Allah help you ameen.

Answer 9

speak to your local iman, maybe he would speak to your father and make things easier for you.this man you fancy would also need to appraoch your father and ask to marry that way.

Answer 10

In Islam it is haraam to have a secret marriage and a secret lover.  The marriage has to be announced to the man's parents, the woman's parents, and the community.  I believe that Saudi women can only marry Saudi men. Besides if you marry a man who isn't Saudi your children will not get Saudi citizenship.

Answer 11

I dont think that any of you are really young. This is the average age for marriage for a girl in KSA and the boy is not that far off.

I am not sure if you need permission to marry from your father- unless that is a rule for women over 30. But I did hear a discussion on similar lines.

Now, I doubt you will find a sheikh here in KSA to marry you in secret as he would not want to get in trouble himself. How could he sign a paper that is not recognised by the country where he is operating? I doubt he would do that. Only if you travel abroad you can obtain the paper.

Nevertheless, I doubt that is the solution; i think the right path is not obvious at this stage.

Do you think you can work harder to convince your parents?

If not, do you have the capacity as individuals- both financially and emotionally to claim independence in achieving your goal- knowing for well that it will take quite some time for such a marriage to settle in both counties....

Anyhow I feel that only time will tell, but you would need a lot more patience to achieve your goal and rushing into any steps regarding marriage papers might bring on more problems than success at this stage.

Answer 12

igaree with you sashik !!

اول شي لبنان الحين ماحصلوا رئيس وانت تبين تتزوجين واحد ؟ ياخي اذا مافيه احد خطبك والله انا مستعد اخطبك ترا انا والله خريج صيدله وانتظر الوظيفه ابدا واتركي عنك  ÃƒÂ˜Ã‚§Ã™Â„بنانى ابو كلام لووول واذا جاده وخلي عنك الحب ام كلثوم << ابي ادخل عرض قالت حب ايه الي انت جايه تقول عليه يابنت الناس وش تبين في لبنانى الله يهديك بس المفروض تكونين وطنيه واذا خربت الدعوه فكري في اماراتى لبنانى ؟ افااا والله لو يدرون عنك اهلك انك كاتبه السؤال هنا فصلوا النت عنك وانا ابصم على العشره انك بنت عز ابورصيده مايقل عن الملايين اللهم لا حسد ولا تبي اللبنان يكون وريث ؟ سعودي مقبووله !!! الله يعين بس على االجيل الجديد اهااا كله من المسلسل التركي الي يعرض على ام بي سي الله يرجهم لوووووووول لو انه امريكي اقول تم وانا افزع لك لكن لبنانى ولا الله مايستفاد منه ولا ب ز ق  ÃƒÂ˜Ã‚¹Ã˜Â°Ã˜Â±Ã˜Â§ على الفظ لكن هذا الصدق

نصحيه لكم يالبنات لاتكثرون من المسلسلات المكسيكه والهنديه وخااااااااااااااااصه مسلسل نور ترا كله كذب في كذب وترا كلهم نصابين يعنى لاتصدقون كله مسلسل ياخذون عليها فلوووووووووووس وبس

Answer 13

dear hawa...

i'm a saudi woman from jeddah and here's what i think:

"just me" and Sister "h" gave you the "mufeed" as we say...i'm not going to discuss "how" you two met and the "nature" of your relationship and wither it's valid or strong and good enough to end up in marriage and go through all what you're talking about for. but i am going to tell you this: if your parents went through the same situation but are opposing yours then there must be some logical reason to that...did you consider that they may know what you can't see due to your infatuation? if you are a virgin in islam you need your guardians approval, i.e. your father. unless you believe he has no good reason to oppose then you can go to court and the judge will marry you. however, think about this...you will alianate your self and your future children from your family...there's the nationality issues...and another important factor is the parents of the guy, why do they oppose? do you two want to marry despite the fact that this marriage might isolate both of you and your kids from both families?

i do salute you that you realize that your current situation is not right and that you want to make it Halal...but from the info you gave us (which is not really enough to make a fair judgement) the cons to this marriage and relationship outweigh the pros...this has nothing to do with you two being of different nationalities, if he's a good muslim and could provide for you and take care of you and your kids...then no one should stand in your way...but to me it seems there are other aspects that have your father and his family reject this whole thing...and unless you work things out peacfully and get all thier blessings...i don't recomend the "romeo & Juliette" dramatic approach...you two maybe in your 20s and old enough to get married...but something seems off...maybe your emotions are crippling your judgment. have a deep honest look at your situation ...and god help u

Answer 14

.......as of this time, your father closed his ears and heart for your decision to marry a non-Saudi guy.....maybe he have other intentions for you, talk to his friend or relative before and already agreed to marry you to someone else.....if there's already an arranged marriage for you planned by your father, its very hard for him to change that plan thats why he's very firm on telling you a big "No".  The only thing, that you can do is to convince him no matter what to avoid problems in the future. Anyways, your lover's parents doesn't agree to this setup also, might as well wait for the right moment wherein both parties to be involved are already ok with it. Otherwise, you'll just making the situation more complicated. Both of you are still young, and ideal marriage is on their late 20's not early 20's so you still have time to do what is right and not be carried away by your emotions.....If you're able to withstand the pressure when you're already on your late 20's, it means your meant for each other really and not just a love at first sight thing.....entering in a marriage is a sacred vow and should be entered if both parties are already fully prepared including the families.......good luck!.....I just hope you're doing the right decision and not just a quick decision what runs on your mind.....sometimes, too much emotions are not good for a situation as sensitive as this.....marriage is for life and its not a game.....so, one should be prepared for this and not to say, anyways there's divorce if problems arises.....

Answer 15

Have you tried talking to one of your uncles, one that you have a strong relation with, and preferably older than your father, maybe he will bless your marriage and you will have a better standing.

Answer 16

Marriage is not a  game (sorry to disappoint you)..

It is a total responsibility  to be able ( with the help of God) to produce human being ..

Your ( possible prospect husband) زوج المستقبل المحتمل is Lebanese ,so he will take your children to Lebanon..CAN YOU LIVE WITH THAT??

He will also raise the the Lebanese way,,DO YOU ACCEPT THAT,,

if yes ,,swear that you don't go back in your words and marry him....

Answer 17

Relationships like that, usually over the phone for the most part, arent as strong as thought to be. And once living together, when reality hits, many, notice the difference.

If BOTH parents even are against it, theres probably good reasons..... and its not just abuse of their authority.....

you can talk to relatives who could persuade your dad and mom.... and he could do the same..

Civil legal marriages, may be legally binding there and wherever, but they are certainly not recognized in Islam as marriages... as theres conditions and pillars for marriages in Islam, such as two witnesses, agreement of the Wali, and Mahr( dowry ) , and so on...

So recognized in front of Allah, requires fulfilling the conditions set down by Him, and the pillars.... and for a marriage to be recognized by a court, you satisfy the conditions of that court... they are two distinct marriages

If the Islamic marriage conditions are fulfilled, the marriage can be done, even if not registered in KSA or wherever..

The prophet peace and blessings be upon him said.. "There is no Nikah without a Wali"

And in another hadeeth "Any woman who marries herself without the [permission of] her Wali, her Nikah is Baatil ( false), he said it three times...

And in another hadeeth Al Zaniyah is the one التي تنكح نفسها who marries herself.

روى أبو داود وغيرُه من حديث أبي بردة عن أبيه – أبي موسى الأشعري- : أن رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم قال : " لا نكاح إلا بولي " ( أبو داود 2085) ( الترمذي : 1102) ( ابن ماجه : 1880) ( ابن حبان : 4075) وصححه ، ( الحاكم : 2710) وصححه كذلك .

والثاني من حديث عائشة ايما امرأة نكحت بغير اذن مواليها فنكاحها باطل.. وكررها ثلاثا...

قال الترمذي : والعملُ في هذا الباب على حديث النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم " لا نكاح إلا بولي " عند أهل العلم من أصحاب النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم منهم عمر ابن الخطاب ، وعلي بن أبي طالب ، وعبد الله بن عباس ، وأبو هريرة وغيرهم ، وهكذا رُوي عن بعض فقهاء التابعين أنهم يقولون:" لا نكاح إلا بولي" منهم سعيد بن المسيب ، والحسن البصري ، وشُريح , وإبراهيم النخعي وعمر بن عبدالعزيز وغيرهم .

وبهذا القول يقول سفيان الثوري, والأوزاعي ، ومالك, وعبد الله بن المبارك والشافعي, وأحمد , وإسحاق .

وقال ابن رشد الحفيد في ( بداية المجتهد 2/10) :" ذهب مالك إلى أنه لا يكون النكاح إلا بولي وأنها شرط في الصحة"

وقال البغوي في شرح السُنّة ( 9/40) : " والعمل على حديث النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم " لا نكاح إلا بولي " عند عامة أهل العلم من أصحاب النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم ومن بعدهم "

ونقل الحافظُ عن ابن المنذر في ( الفتح 9/187) قوله : " إنّه لا يُعرف عن أحد من الصحابة خلاف ذلك "

روى الترمذي وغيره عن عائشة – رضي الله عنها – (( أنّ رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم قال : أيّما امرأة نكحت بغير إذن وليها فنكاحها باطل ، فنكاحها باطل ، فنكاحها باطل ، فإن دخل بها فلها مهر المثل بما استحل من فرجها فإن اشتجروا فالسلطان ولي من لا ولي له ))

( الترمذي 1108) وحسّنه ، وقال الحافظُ : " وصحّحه أبو عوانه وابنُ خزيمة ، وابنُ حبان والحاكم " [ الفتح 9/184]

Another thing is, a verse from the Qur'an "Fala Ta'dihloohonn" فلا تعضلونهن  

and Al Adl العضل is preventing a girl from marriage ( abuse of authority ) , which is a great sin in Islam....

In this case, the girl can go to those in authority and basically sue your father, the judge will look into the abuse of authority of the father, and will have the power to marry her. Chances are, its not abuse of authority, but this is good to know in extreme cases.

So taking that route would just be tricking yourself and too extreme I think...

This is why its always said, the way to marry a girl is to officially knock the door and talk to her dad. Long term relationships, without knowledge of parents arent healthy at all and only lead to all sorts of problems.

Anyway, all you can do is basically lobby and try hard, and honestly? before even doing that, especially for girls ( and guys too ), stay away from him for a while... so that you can be able to think outside of the box, and see things clearly...

Whenever a person is under any strong feelings, anger, love, happiness, sadness, its the wrong time to make decisions.... so id say take a long as you can away from him, and everything related to the issue even... then you'll have a clear mind, a clear image, and be able to think outside of the box.... ( I myself, sometimes travel to have a clear mind and focus )

Then pray istikhara

If you really do that, I dont think you'll find it hard dealing with the issue and making a decision.

Then if you insist on it, you continue to persuade relatives etc.... its just a matter of time... some parents feel like they dont want their daughter or son to get married at all and cant comprehend that they are now grown-ups... but end up realizing and accepting it...

So take things slowly, deal with the issue wisely... and again, having relatives on your side, always helps...

============

Just to clarify, "Wali" doesnt mean witness, it means Wali Amr, it means your "guardian" who is your father. So in even in a Muslim country theres no guardian. You can pay someone to play the role of the guardian, or do it without one, but, you read the hadeeths about it being a major pillar of an Islamic marriage, and the rest is between you and God..

You sound like you are from Jeddah, where people tend to be more lenient and understanding about such things,  but even though, for an Islamic marriage, you'd still have to follow the pillars and conditions of marriage in Islam. If someone marries you two without a Wali, or you pay someone to be the Wali.. well.. its your life.. just know that God knows and sees it all..

Even if you take that route which naturally would cause many family problems if your uncles on your mothers side are involved, Id still ask a shiekh on how and even IF an uncle from the mothers side can be the wali.

In the US at our masjid, when there was a new Muslimah, who wanted to get married, the Imam would take the role of the Wali, being the Imam of the local Muslim community since she has no Muslim Wali.

Its the easy way out is to travel, but as I said, taking things slowly, and wisely, with family involved, will never hurt. It will only help.

وبالمناسبة كلمة my lover

لها ايحاء  ÃƒÂ™Ã‚ˆÃ™Â…عنى جنسي.. فممكن تنفهمين غلط عند استخدامها...

فالأفضل انتقاء كلمة اخرى

Answer 18

My cousin used to live in Jeddah and she secretly moved to America and married an African American man and now she is having problems with him and she has no one to turn to and she finally convinced him to buy her a one way ticket back. So, what you should get out of this story is be sure you love him. The better thing is to introduce him to ur parents, in the end they will be happy if you are happy and plus they should be glad that he is a good muslim it shouldnt matter where he is from. If you cant talk to ur parents talk to a sheik and ask him what he might advise you guys to do

Answer 19

Dear,

I feel sorry for you and I know exactly what you are going through. Well, I will leave Religion out and want you to see the practical side of the steps you may take.

You mentioned your parent's secret marriage. Well I assume your father was the Saudi and your mother the foreigner, right? Different for a Saudi girl who wants to marry a foreigner.

Prior approval of the Saudi Department of Interior is out of question without your father's approval.

You say that you are thinking about getting married in a foreign country with a Sheikh. Please check out the different laws regarding marrige of foreigners in other countries. Mostly you have to be a resident to get married and you have to register your marriage at your Embassy. Here are the rules for the UAE:

http://www.gulfnews.com/uaessentials/res...

Please take into consideration, that your kids will not be Saudis. In case you will relocate in Lebanon you can apply for Lebanese citizenship and in the meantime the KSA embassy will be responsible for your passport issues. Please note that Lebanon is not considered being a Muslim country.

Also when it's always said that the UAE is westernized and open, even here an Emirati girl needs permission to marry a foreigner (Muslim). My friend did the big mistake (her family did not agree either) to marry a british Muslim. They lived in Austria, means: she did not apply for british citizenship. Her passport run out, she went to the UAE Embassy in Vienna and got told that they are not responsible. She got talked into going back to Abu Dhabi to straight things out and nothing would happen to her. To make a long story short - since 7 months she is looked up now in a special forster home. Not allowed to receive visitors, make up, books etc. She got told that the UAE Authorities really do not have a reason to keep her, but her brothers are threathening to kill her. She's stuck right now and we do not know what to do. I even placed a question regarding her: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;...

Even if it will be possible to make the nikah somewhere else, you still will not be able to live together with your hubby in KSA.

Please try hard to convince your father with the help of the family members being on your side to agree with your husband. Do it the "right" way to look forward to a bright future instead running into one problem after the other.

to bad that you did not mention any reason why your father and your future husband's family do not agree with you getting married. Maybe it's for a reason that can be resolved?

I wish you and your "lover":)) all the best and hope for the both for you that you be strong enough to solve the problems.

Salam.

Answer 20

keep from zinna.