I'm a small farmer & I do food storage, have an interesting question...?

Question

I'm a small farmer, in Idaho. I've very close to agriculture (unlike the average American).

I also do food storage, about a years worth at any given time in my pantry.

Because I'm so close to agriculture, and because I do food storage, I buy in bulk from as close to the source as possible.

I buy my white flour directly from Pendelton Flour Mill, 8 miles from my house. Two years ago I could buy 50 pound bags of flour for $5. This year, they are $25-$30 per 50 pound bag of flour.

This price increase is DIRECTLY related to the demand for grains (corn, wheat, barley, ect) for biofuel production.

So how does this kind of a dramatic price increase, now that you know it has happened, make you feel? Worried? Don't care? No big deal? OMG the sky is falling?

Answer 1

A little research might help here.  Is the price of wheat five to six times what it was two years ago?  No.  Then something else is causing the problem, right?

Here's a starting point:  

http://www.ers.usda.gov/Data/Wheat/YBtab...

Answer 2

Sign of the times. And expect most commodity prices to continue to rise, expecially food. The recent weather extremes in China are going to have an impact, and the continuing exportation of the "American Way of Life" to second and third world conuntries has an effect.

The primary cause of global warming and the resualtant environmental ecological disasters is global over-population. But it is seldom, if ever, discusssed -- and when it is, it is mentioned, and then we move on. Until the focus of global warming becomes one of reducing population growth it pretty much does not matter what we do to individually reduce our "carbon footprint" because for every step back we may take China and India take two (or three or more) very large steps forward. In the year 2006 over 21 million new cars were sold to first time car buyers in China, India, and Eastern Europe -- these are folks that have never owned a car in all their life. Just to "stay even" means that 21 million cars in America (or Western Europe) would have to be garaged.

It is a GLOBAL problem, and we will not "fix it" by applying band aids here and there and thinking that somehow technology will save the day. The rapidity of environmental/ecological change is accelerating and many now believe we may have passed the "tipping point."

You are wise to be focused on how to get through the tough times coming ahead. Check out the candle heater on google -- it may help a bit in your situation.

In 1973 Americans were standing in line to buy gas, 10 years later we are building SUV's -- we are not very smart people. As long as we continue with the concepts that "bigger is better" that "more is better" that "sacrifice is good, as long as it is somebody else makine the sacrifice" we havn't a chance.

The ice caps are melting. The real danger there is not the rising sea levels, but we do not know what is in the ice! There are pathogens (bacteria and viruses) in the ice that have been frozen for thousands and thousands of years. Probably at "their time" we probably had some level of immunity, but now, 10 thousand years later, that immunity has probably been breed out of us. Put "new diseases" in google.

As small farmers you know birds peck at everything, comes from having no hands, migratory waterfowl are pecking at stuff that is melting out of the ice this very minute, and if it doesn't kill them on the spot, they will share it with their friends, and when they all take off to visit other countries they will carry whatever with them. Where do you think the new strain of bird flu came from in the first place?

Grain prices go up and down, but mostly up, since populaton, and hence demand, are continuing to increase. The most effective thing anyone can do to help decrease carbon footprint is to not have babies, sad to say. The carbon footprint of each new person will be much larger than the carbon footprint of the parents.

So where do we go from here? Who knows. The recent "melt-down" in the housing market, which was artificially driven high by unscrupulous financial institutions continues to show us that all we care about is money, making it, getting it, having it, wanting it, and we can never have enough. It is this kind of thinking that lies at the root of the problem. As long as we continue to be greedy people, as long as we want more than we need how can we possibly live a gentle and "small footprint" life.

The homes being built today are 27% larger than the homes that were built 25 years ago (in America) -- and have fewer people living in them. Folks are quick to point out that these newer homes do not use any more energy than the older homes, which is true and is good -- but They Did Use 27% More Materials! -- now didn't they. They exemplify the "head in the sand" attitude that somehow we can have our cake and eat it to.

Ah, cake, back to the problem with wheat. Well, good, maybe if wheat gets a bit pricey we will quit throwing away that half a sandwich, and save it for later. Maybe we will order the Medium pizza instead of the large, maybe we will cut back on the excessive amounts of calories we are consuming and drop a few pounds . . . that would be a good thing.

Maybe the cakes we will bake will be more modest and less often, and become more meaningful. Maybe it will really mean something when someone bakes you a cake, or a loaf of bread, because it really did cost a lot -- not just the time and labor, but even the ingredients. Maybe we will learn to appreciate what we have and value the simpler things in life, the kinder things in life, the friendships, the love of family.

It is a sign of the times. Do not be afraid, for every door that closes, another will open. Look up, move forward, do good, start now. The worst that can happen is that we all die, and no matter what we do or where we do it, that is going to happen anyway. Try to live a gentle life, examine your goals, examine who your "heroes" are, and if you really want to make a difference, get rid of your TV -- more than any other infulence it has made us all into money grubbing fools, mindlessly sucking in the artificial desires of the advertisers and the unreality of life. Plant a garden, read a book, smell the roses.

d

Answer 3

No matter how we dress this up, no matter what questions we ask from the energy crisis to rising food prices, from adverse weather events to thousands of people starving worldwide. The answer is the same.

The ONLY CRISIS we have is a CRISIS OF CONSUMPTION.

The ONLY ANSWER we have is to learn to limit it.

The crisis of consumption will not disappear. So we can solve it  the easy way, by choice, or the hard way, by pretending it is not happening and letting Nature deal with it! Because she will.

Answer 4

Sounds like a big inflation. Bad luck =(

Answer 5

The whole farming issue in the U.S. is extremely scary.  We are becoming more and more dependent on foreign countries for our food.  If we think being dependent on oil is a problem...oh boy...!!

We do the food storage thing too..  My husband rotates things on a weekly bases when we shop at the market.  We started storing wheat about 30 years ago when our church urged everyone to begin saving a years supply of food and we've done this ever since -  but the past 3 or 4 years .. we make it a priority. It doesn't take a lot of imagination to see what will happen to the food at our local markets when a crisis happens. It also should be obvious to anyone who eats..the price of staples, such as flour, has risen dramatically as you stated.

We have good friends who are wheat farmers...boy ..such a deal...There really is no way anymore for the small family farm to exist..we are all so complacent..food has always been here.... I guess I'm in the "worried and trying to plan"

group!  Good luck...♥

Answer 6

Maybe you should check that idea that it is DIRECTLY related to biodiesel and ethanol production.  I'd be curious to see how that is true when the bio-fuel currently in production is either corn or recycled grease-based fuel.  Perhaps you should more closely investigate how oil prices (i.e. energy costs, and costs of oil byproducts such as herbicides and pesticides, the increased global demand for grains from emerging economies (China, India), the decline in value of the U.S. dollar, as well as transportation of the grains to the facility) effect the cost of production in large and small-scale operations.  Most certainly, the answer to our environmental issues with regard to transportation is not a wholesale change to bio-fuels, as it currently takes more energy to grow the corn than it produces in returns as auto fuel.  But, I believe your wholesale increase in flour prices are due to increased energy costs as well as increased global demand for grains. and energy prices.  I don't know anyone who's making bio fuels out of wheat yet.

Answer 7

Yeah, actually this does really worry me. I am only a Freshman in High School, but I think big. I get where you are going. If flour, a basic staple of our lives, increases in price soo much, it will effect nearly everything. It will eventually cause a chain reaction. Big as the great depression? Could be, when no one was getting payed enough to buy their necessities. As they say History repeats itself. I don't want to grow up in a world where I might have to look my starving children in the eye and explain to them why they can't eat. Something should be done.

On another note, I have always loved the idea of living on a farm and really envy what you have. It has always been my dream to live on a peaceful patch of land with a horse and some chickens. Enjoy it!

Answer 8

the price of wheat is not 5 to 6 times what it was 2 years ago so I do not see how the price of your flour is DIRECTLY related.  Yes, the price is up and the demand but not that much.

Answer 9

I care to hear more about this. I have heard that this biofuel issue is a good platform for understanding economy impact.

How much have the other grains risen in terms of bulk prices?

Is someone getting rich quick?

Answer 10

Wow, that's a significant increase. Is it only that one supplier who is doing this? what changes has that business gone thru in the last 2 years?  Did they get bought out? did their employees' union recently negotiate for a wage increase ?

I buy things as cheaply as I can but I plan to get out my little hand-operated grain grinder, & get back to grinding my own flour again. I did this back when Y2K was a big worry, &  the health benefits were  definitely worth the time spent increasing my bicep strength. <grin>         And whole grain is much cheaper than milled flour.   I haven't done as much for the last 2 years -- been busy; but I'm getting back to it now.

but as for the "average" person, who doesn't even know how to make their own bread with store-bought flour & store-bought yeast  -- yes, I do feel sorry for them.

thanks to technology like the Internet, people can learn skills like home-canning & gardening -- they don't have to try to find a neighbor who knows how -- but it does take some willingness to be a tad inconvenienced, & to give up some extras that we think are necessities. (We don't really need to watch 6 hours of TV a day, for example.)

just my 2 cent's worth.

Answer 11

I'm like, "I KNEW IT" and simulataneously like, "I JUSTIFIABLY HATE BIOFUELS!!"

Answer 12

I think worried especially for those farmers like you. It can almost get too expensive to move on and soon all farms that aren't major will be out of business which creates a lot of problems. This demand for a type of food that people who are poor as well as early exploreres used as a cheap food source that was very common is now leaving our planet. Animals will die if they run out of food and even our food will become more and more uncommon. It is actually sad that it went so high in only two years...makes you wonder what's next.  :(

Answer 13

Ok, A few corrections are needed here.

1st:  Heater J...do you eat bread?  If so what part of the MAIN ingredient on bread doubling in the last year is a good thing?????

2nd:  TNA...same question...if you eat pizza, hamburgers, bread, twinkies, ring dings, etc you are going to pay more.  Also, if you have pets, Dogs and cats for starters, guess what, there is WHEAT in food for both.

3rd:  inonothing...I concur, you do know nothing.  The price in SEPTEMBER was twice what it was in September 2006.  Here is a quote from USA Today.  "Wheat for December delivery closed at $9.33 a bushel in Chicago, more than double the price from a year ago. Drought in Australia and poor crops in other nations helped drive U.S. and world supplies to the lowest levels in decades. U.S. wheat stocks are pegged at 362 million bushels in 2007-08, the tightest since 1973-74."  http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries...  

4th:  Cyborg Troy... I think you are taking it a bit far.  I concur that using Corn to make ethanol is a bad idea, it is upside down or nearly so on the energy equation depending on who's numbers you use.  However, Switchgrass and some of the other crops they are using for ethanol are much better sources on the energy equation.  Switchgrass can also be grown on marginal ground that will not support crops to feed livestock or people.  Also, people do not eat switchgrass, and it is not a prime animal feed, so where is the loosing side of this one?  Biofuel = good, biofuel from corn = bad.

5th:  Julie...you are right and wrong all at the same time.  Yes, the price of fuel has gone up which has driven up the price of GROWING wheat.  The price of growing a crop has NOTHING to do with what it sells for.  The price of fuel has been rising for the last few years...thei is the FIRST TIME in 3 decades that wheat has been better than a break even crop.  And before you ask, farmers grow wheat to rotate out their other crops...alfalfa, potatoes, sugar beets, soybeans, etc.  Around here, the only way that the potato growers have been able to control the price of potatoes is by DUMPING 6 MILLION TONS of potatoes on the ground to ROT in 2006, and by banding together so that everyone could plant a bit less and keep the supply a bit tighter.  This is extremely rare and does not happen with all crops/regions.  On the energy equation (takes more energy to grow than energy you get out of it) see above rebuttal.  As for "I'd be curious to see how that is true when the bio-fuel currently in production is either corn or recycled grease-based fuel... "  google bio diesel porduction plants...they are making it from canola and other crops directly.  

You are right on the money that there is more than 1 reason for the increase...but not wholly there on your arguments.

On the other side of things:

Rivka...you have a great point.  If trends follow, wheat will drop down next year...but probably not nearly as far as they came up.

Camille...BRAVO!!! You have restored my faith that not all teenagers are too self absorbed to see anything beyond their immediate needs/concerns!  Very Very nice answer!  By the way, living\working on a small farm is alot of work, but it is rewarding.

Still Here...all I can say is HERE HERE!!  I cannot bring myself to eat watermelon anymore.  It is a sad sad thing.

sundaizie...Well said!  Keep working at it, it sounds like you are better prepared than 99% of the nation!

Just a thought for folks...do you buy food from the local area...Farmers Market's, etc?  This is the best way to support your local small farmers.  Why support the small farmers?  Who do you think will have food for sale if the transportation system...hiccups or colapses?  As a point of curiosity...does anyone realize that it takes 10,000 truckloads of freight PER DAY to support the L.A.  basin?  Ask someone that lived down that way what happened when the truckers went on strike back in the '70's if you do not believe me.  And if you think that the transportation industry cannot collapse or have a small hiccup, you are sorely mistaken.  The trucking industry has been short of drivers for 2 decades.  

For me I am in the "Worried-and-trying- to-get-me-and-mine- set-up-better-so- we-can- ride-this-out" camp.

Offio

Born and raised on a small farm, running my own now for years.

p.s.  I do not raise wheat.  All of my neighbors do, and I talk with them regularly.  (wheat is a crop that is better done on a large scale...since it has paid so little traditionally.

Answer 14

no i truthfully don't care that much. I am just being honest. I don't deal with corn and grains at all so in my view, you should have bought some stock in the flour market. you would be rich now

Answer 15

The increase in these prices is astounding.  Not only this but there is a whole other issue involved which is that the seed supply seems to have been tampered with and the quality of the food itself (even if home grown) has deteriorated dramatically.  When I was a kid my dad's garden was our supply (in summer - Canada) of tomatoes, onions, cucumber, swiss chard (like spinach), green peppers, asparagus, lettuce, strawberries, potatoes sometimes, carrots, dill.  We didn't realize how lucky we were - it was great although taken for granted.  

Now I appreciate how fortunate we were, but it did spoil me a bit because nowadays tomatoes don't taste anything like they did back then.  I don't even buy cucumbers anymore cause they have almost no cucumber taste at all.  Watermelon is a horrible disappointment - it doesn't taste anything like it used to and has a funny aftertaste.   The worst though I must say is the lack of flavor in tomatoes and cucumbers - it still shocks me whenever I taste either.

Now on top of all that we also have to pay such exorbitant prices and we aren't even getting the real thing anymore.

Answer 16

Im in the UK and work to the same principles, I farm, rear all our own meat, grow all our own veg & buy in dried goods in bulk from the local wholesaler.

The price of flours here has gone through the roof, but it is in direct relation to the huge increases in the price of crude oil, increase in price of fuels - increase in price of haulage.

Answer 17

I love it, cant wait to use enthanol fuel!!!

Answer 18

I am old enough that I have seen price fluctuations that have been beyond belief.  I remember in 1973 that the price of a 50 pound sack of beans (pinto) went up so high that it was actually cheaper to buy a few chickerns and a side of beef to get through the winter than to buy the beans.

I remember a time when grapes were not worth buying unless you were doing it to garnish a plate or impress someone.  I remember a time when iceberg lettuce went up to $5.00 a head.  

I also remember a time when I was growing up that you could buy bread at 20 cents a loaf.  Of course, back then it was all white.  Now there are many more varieties of bread on the market and maybe that is why bread costs more than 10 times what it used to.

Price fluctuations just do not bother me.

BTW, I was raised near where now live.

Answer 19

The whole issue makes me angry.

The price of food hasn't gone up since the 60's, while everything else has. Maybe it is a good thing that grain prices go up becuase it will force people to focus on basic needs(like food, water, air, instead of TVs, cellphones, ect.)

Maybe it will wake up "America," to how the rest of the whole world is living like. Good Bye sugarcoated world!...no more time for soccer practice or watching tv!...get back to fields and grow food! fun time is over.

I say BRING IT! Personally, I can't wait until it's all over. "Until the sky falls." Maybe than we could get some real peace of mind and live with honesty.

Answer 20

worried that is  a huge increase.. what will it be in another two years?!

Answer 21

What also concerns me is the farmers around here were paid to grow the corn to full maturity and then were also paid to plow whole fields under.  The crops were never harvested just plowed under.

The farmers that did this were approached by USDA and were paid to grow the corn and then again were approached by USDA to be paid to plow the stuff under unharvested.  

The farmers said that this practice was widespread to keep the prices HIGH!

So I am old enough to remember $ .19 (CENTS) a gallon gas and bread white and wheat 10 loves for $1.00 and yes it was much better tasting then than it is now.

My husband and I together in 1977 brought in $610.00 a month.  Min wage was $2.35/hour.  Our rent was $110.00 per month for a 2 bedroom house.  We lived quiet well.

Now I alone bring in $4500.00 per month, my mortgage is $1200.00 per month, and I only have after all expenses are paid $300.00 per month to buy food and gas to get to work.  I do have a small farm that I am supporting (until it supports me...uh huh....) and 13 horses, 50 pigs, 32 chickens, 2 dogs, 7 cats, and 15 rabbits.

The horses run on 48 acres.  I would sell these but since the slaughter market for horses is gone the rest of the horse market has gone to pot. And it is the rest of the market that I used to sell to now you can't even sell one for $50.00 if you are lucky. $10.00 is the price for zoo food and so the horses can just grow old and stay put.  The pigs are buying the food from sales money for all of the animals.

I do almost everything for the animals that need done.  I took classes to learn how to trim and shoe the horses.  I have always done my own dental work on them and have the tools.  I do all my own vaccines on everything.  The only thing I would take the horses in for is castrating or major stuff.  (Colic surgery etc...) Major stuff just isn't going to get done anymore because I just can't justify the expense.  Actually I never could justify a $5000.00 colic surgery on a horse unless they were money earners and mine are not and you just have to get real sometimes.  I do my own castrating and vaccinating on the pigs.  I do a tremendous amount of shopping around for the best prices.  And I ask for price matches as most companies will price match for like products.

I grow my own hay and I work in the summers for a custom hay contractor.  I also have a contract from one company on all of their dated  milk products that I feed the pigs.  They get alfalfa hay, the dated milk products, Soy Bean Meal, and a vit/min supplement.

I have stopped all trips to town.  Now I go on my way home from work.  I go to auctions to buy used equipment to work the farm with.  I want to grow Camelina seed and buy my own mill for it to make my own biodiesel so I can run the farm machinery entirely from my own plantings.  Then I also want to get a digester to put the pig poo in to make methane gas to power a generator that would supply  this farm and sell excess to the power company.

You talk about seeds not being as potent as they used to be.  This is true that this has happened.  The reason is because of the hybrids.  I was looking at replanting the alfalfa and have been talking with seed companies and their seeds all have to be torn out in about 5 years they are designed to be that way now to fit into the farmers crop rotation cycles.  I have another name for it...planned obsolescence.  I remember alfalfa fields that were still producing 2 to 3 tons to the acre after 15 years but that doesn't make the seed producer any money if something will last 15 years versus 5 years.....planned obsolescence is everywhere and everything these days is made or produced with that in mind.  The faster something wears out the sooner the consumer will buy another one.  The new HDTV's....5 to 8 years is all they are going to last.  Then you will have to buy a new one.  Will I ....no....my TV is 20 years old and still works fine.  I don't have to have the latest and greatest that is on the shelves.  Even my computer is not a shelf product.  I built it myself.  Cost $120.00.  120 Gig HD, 2 Gigs RAM, CD/RW, a DVD/R writer and player, and still a 3.5 diskette drive.  A used castaway flat screen that works perfectly fine..free...my scanner and printer I bought of eBay for about $50.00 each so total into a system that works just fine for what I want it for $220.00.  

My car has 200,000 miles on it.  I just recently put a clutch in it.  And yes I did it myself.  If I own it.  I learn how to work on it.  I know how to work on my own house as well.  I can wire to code.  I can frame, do cement work, insulate, sheetrock & texture, paint, do finish work (woodwork), plumbing, and yes I have acquired throughout the years the tools and the knowledge to be able to do all that I do myself.  

And I have a stock of seeds to grow food.  I also have a stock of food to get me thru until the food is grown.  And I almost forgot the guns and ammo stash....a must have for anyone wanting to survive.

Answer 22

Thank you for such a truly interesting post.  I have enjoyed reading it and will do some research on it.

Answer 23

Sad.