I shoot lead bullets do you think if I drop my powder charge it will cut down on leading?

Question

What should the FPS be to stop the lead from melting in barrel

Answer 1

I am a master bulletsmith.

You cannot change the laws of physics.  Any charge capable of sending a chunk of lead - 25 auto to 338 Win Mag - faster than 1,000 fps will the lead the barrel.  For loads over 1,000 fps you should be using bullets with a 'gas check'.  These are little copper butt cover for the bullet - but - they only fit bullets designed for them.

You are totally correct that dropping your charge will cut down on leading.  That is the best thing to do with the bullets you are currently using.

When you want to go back up to 1000 fps and beyond - you will need to go with either gas check or jacketed bullets.  Sometimes it is hard to find gas checked bullets locally - and these days the cost of shipping lead it out of this world.  You might want to consider casting your own bullets.  It does not require allot of equipment - especially with the new Lee Bullet sizer dies - hopefully they have one in your caliber.  You will like casting your own bullets - rather than being stuck with just lead and what ever cheapo things they added to make it hard - you can add small amounts of tin or even nickle - nickle makes a great alloy that is hard and kinda shinny.  Makes your bullets look very nice.

Hope this helps.

Answer 2

It really depends on the bullets and velocity.

If the bullets you are shooting are dead soft swaged lead bullets, back the charge down drastically.  Most of those soft lead bullets lead like crazy if the velocity is over around 900 fps.

If you are using hard cast bullets with a good lube, you should not be having leading problems at any reasonable revolver velocity, or under 1800 fps with a rifle.  I've shot hard cast bullets at over 2000 fps with no leading problem.

If you are casting your own bullets, you can do some experimentation with different lube formulations.  If you are shooting commercially cast and lubed bullets, there isn't much you can do other than back down the velocity a bit and see what happens.

Good Luck, and Good Shooting,

Doc

Answer 3

Clearly this ANSWER depends upon who you ask! Your attempt to solve all your problems when using swaged pure lead bullets which quickly lead up your barrel, simply by reducing speed, will require you to keep the throttle below 1000 fps and consider the use of a gascheck-type bullet. The gas-check doesn't actually check gas, but it scrapes out lead more or less as fast as it is deposited, keeping the situation down to "acceptable" for a day's shooting. That is, at some quickly reached point, the lead stops accumulating at a level which doesn't hurt accuracy all that much, and you can continue on blasting away! But lead alloys enter the picture. Moving up to the one part tin in 20 parts lead "standard mix", you can get away with somewhat more velocity. But the savvy people add some 50-50 tin/lead body solder to sweeten the pot to one part tin in 15 parts lead! Here is where the cast bullet magnum shooters smugly don't tell anyone how they did it! The 1 in 15 is special order if you can find it! Or you can just add about 80% of a 1 lb 50/50 body solder ingot to 9 lbs of 1 in 20, and have about 10 lbs of 1 in 15 magnum cast alloy. Or put the whole lb of body solder in 10 lbs of 1 in 20, and have 11 lbs of 1 in 15 which might overfill a 10 lb pot! Or scale the whole works down for smaller pots. Of course, the autoloader people have an even harder alloy, the "hardball" 2% tin, 6%antimony, 92%lead stuff, intended for smooth and reliable cycling on the feed ramp! But this stuff might shatter on a big bone, so it's not really for hunting. And the lineotype alloy 4%tin, 12%antimony, 84%lead definitely has a brittleness feature, shattering reliably on steel targets or stone backstops, which is necessary in a lot of places! So there you have it, pick your alloy, and don't inhale the fumes when you melt metals. http://www.midwayusa.com/ has everything you will need, except the body solder, which auto parts stores have ubiquitously. (Don't tell anyone, but some of the magnum cast bullet hunters use one part hardball, or a slash of lineotype, added to several parts 1 in 20.) Regards, Larry.

Answer 4

Yes, the solution to your problem is to reduce the charge until you are shooting at about 850 ft. per sec.  The lead does not melt from your bullet, it is scraped off by the high velocity at which the bullet is moving through your barrel.  If you fire the bullet at a velocity that is too high, it is unable to grip the lands in the bore and is forced down the barrel across the lands.  The lands act sort of like a rasp in removing lead from the bullet.  In heavier weight bullets, this can cause the bullet not to spin fast enough to stabilize and the bullet will "key hole" or go through the target sideways leaving an oblong hole rather than a nice round hole.

Another thing to considere is the hardness of the lead from which the bullet is made.  If the alloy is too soft, it is more prone to leading.  If you are shooting commercial bullets, you are not likely to have this probllem because the manufacturers know how hard to make their bullets.  If you are shooting bullets that either you ar a buddy made, you may need to add some tin or antimony to your lead to get it hard enough.  Also, if you are casting your own bullets, you might try buying a mold for a gas check bullet.  When you size your bullets, you will add a copper gas check to the tail of the bullet.  As it enters the sizing die, the gas check will be crimped onto the base of the bullet.  This helps to cut down on leading in the bore.

First step, reduce your charge to give you a muzzle velocity of around 850 fps.  If you still have leading problems try using a harder alloy in your bullets.  Since using a gas check involves buying a new bullet mold, I'd try that only as a last resort.

This is where I buy my lead bullets.  They make the best lead bullets that I have found.  The ones to buy are those called Laser Cast bullets.  www.laser-cast.com

Here is a reference that you might find enlightening:

www.lasc.us/CastBulletNotes.htm

Answer 5

lead cast bullets need to be loaded at lower limits to reduce leading, especially in magnum or high velocity cartridges. start with the lowest load in the manual, and make sure it is a loading recommended for lead. work up from there. if you are buying lead cast bullets in bulk, make sure they are hard cast.

some calibers will lead the barrel worse than others. 9mm often gave me trouble with leading.

to cut down on the leading problem load one jacketed bullet as your last round in a firing string, this will clear a lot of the leading for you.

Answer 6

GAS CHECK is the simplest answer.

I had a bad experience once with Speer cast bullets. They are not hard cast. The mix probably needed more tin and antimony because they were so soft. I had to shoot those at low pressure to lessen the leading problems. I ended up melting and recasting in sand and making a canoe anchor.

Answer 7

Hi el,

Moly coating should cut down on that if your not already.

Answer 8

The only person who has come close to answering your question, was actually the master gunsmith, but there is another solution to your problem.

As he stated and powder charge is going to present a potential problem.  Mainly because the powder burns hot enough to slightly soften the lead at the rear of the bullet.  There is really nothing you can do except change your manufacturer of the bullets.

The two companies that I use for my reloading that seem to have the best results are Black Bear Bullets, (I don't know if they are still around), and my mainstay, (Oregon Trail, AKA: Laser Cast).

Their bullets are cast with a lead/silver combination that does a pretty fine job.  I also make sure the bullets are Moly Coated which will also reduce the leading factor.  They do the Moly Coating at their plant.  They do a really nice job, and so far the leading has been kept to a minimum in my revolvers.

In my semi-autos, though I will only use jacketed bullets.  But I also don't buy the most expensive jacketed bullets either.  Oregon Trail also makes jacketed bullets, (copper plated), as they term it.

In my revolvers, (Ruger GP-100 .357 Magnum), I normally shoot .38 Special at the range, so the loads are pretty mild for the most part.  125 Grain Bullet with a load of Hodgdon HP-38 @ 5.2 Gr. w/ Winchester Small Pistol Primer= 1019 Fps.

From: Hodgdon Reloading Manual #27.

This has been a really good and accurate load to use.  I use this with both the jacketed bullets and the Lead SWC Bullet.  

As for hopping into the Magnum Catagory I normally stick with the Jacketed Bullets being that they are exceeding 1200 Feet Per Second with a 125 Grain Bullet.

The only issue with dropping a charge is your accuracy is based on a balance of weight and power.  So I would suggest changing brands of bullets before dropping your powder charge.  In any event, you should never drop your powder charge below the published safe SAAMI Limit Data.  This could cause a squib, and the bullet could lodge in the barrel.  Then you are in for a real treat.  

But in any event, I would stick with changing brands.  Just a suggestion, you might check out:

www.midwayusa.com

More than likely, they will be able to make some suggestions too.

Good Luck!

Answer 9

Cutting down on powder charge doesn't always mean it will cut down leading. Sometimes, reduced loads will result in heavier leading. Bullet lube, bullet design, bullet hardness, powder choice and powder charge all have a direct effect on leading. Finding right combinations isn't easy. Sometimes, leading has nothing to do with all of the above. A rough barrel will cause leading even with perfect loads.

Generally speaking, a little lead in the barrel is okay as long as lead doesn't build up to affect accuracy and the barrel is relatively easy to clean after each shooting session. It is very difficult to tell you how fast or how slow you should push your bullets because I don't know what kind of bullet lube is on your bullets, how hot your powder burns and how hard your bullet alloy is.

If you used correct lube, a star shaped lube ring will be left around the crown of the muzzle after each shot. If you do see lube rings at the muzzle, then your powder is burning at correct temperature for your bullet lube.

There are many types of leading. If leading only occurs around certain spots of the barrel, it usually means there are rough spots in your barrel. You could break in your barrel again and see if rough spots could be smoothed. Or, you could have your barrel lapped or fire lapped. All methods I mentioned above are painfully labor intensive and very time consuming. If you want to cut corners, replacing the existing barrel with a match grade barrel seemed to be the only option.

If leading only occurs around or close to the breach, the use of faster burning powder might solve the problem. If faster burning powder didn't solve the problem, try increase the pressure of your ammo; you could also try magnum primers as long as you change ONE variable at a time. If lead still build up around the breach with hot loads, then you bullets are too hard. Hard alloy isn't always good.

If a consistent layer of lead was found from breach to muzzle, it could mean the bullet is too soft. Increase alloy hardness and/or reduce bullet velocity might solve the problem. It could also mean your load is too hot and your bullet base is melting. Harder alloy and/or slower burning powder should take care of the problem in this case. If the bullet isn't very soft to begin with, then it probably means the bullets were pushed out of the barrel too slowly.

I can not list all variables without writing a book. I could only give you some ideas so you could start experimenting on your own. In general, velocities between 650 ft/s to 900 ft/s are good for cast bullets in handguns. Velocities between 1100 ft/s to 1450 ft/s usually worked better for rifles; you should use gas checks if your bullets are not hard enough. But, don't be afraid to try higher velocities if your gun could handle it. Higher velocity don't usually equal excessive leading. If you don't want to experiment too much with your loads, the use of gas checks is the way to go. However, I must tell you the joy of discover is very sweet.

Addition:

Doc, water quenching lead will produce weird results. Lead hardness will actually change over time. Some alloys will become even harder after about 2 days. If given enough time, water quenched lead alloys will eventually loose the surface hardness; lead alloys usually "settle" in only 2 to 4 weeks.

Answer 10

I shoot 44 mag cast lead, and in order to keep from leading things I have to stay under 1000 fps.