If making energy isn't clean for the environment then how clean can electric cars really be?

Question

They say zero emissions when people talk about electric cars. Is it really zero emissions or is it indirect emission?

Answer 1

Gasoline / diesel powered vehicles also have indirect emissions.  Oil refineries pollute.  Oil refineries use gobs of electricity.  Transportation of fuel pollutes.  In the end, the total pollution of an "oil" powered vehicle is likely more than that of an all electric vehicle (I don't know for sure).  Approximately 35% of the nations electrical power comes from sources other than oil and coal.  The current push is toward more nuclear, wind, solar, natural gas and other "alternate" sources of electricity.  

Electric cars are currently unsuitable for most Americans.  They just don't have the speed and range necessary for a dual purpose vehicle (commuting and travel).  The batteries will come to make electric vehicles viable, but it's going to take 10 to 15 years.  Coincidentally, the 20 or so new nuclear reactors in the works will be on the grid around the same time.  A larger percentage of the grid will be supplied by wind and solar by then as well.  It's not a problem that lends itself to a quick solution.  We will just have to be patient.

In the meantime, vehicles like Chevrolet's Volt are a good step forward.  Series hybrid development allows for a commuter vehicle that runs off the grid, and a traveling vehicle that runs on both the grid and gasoline.  It also focuses more R&D money on battery technology.  Series hybrids will bring about a viable all-electric vehicle sooner.  (my opinion of a viable electric vehicle, at least for the US, is one that can travel at least 400 miles/charge at highway speeds and reach full charge in under 2 hours with at least 4000 charge cycles)

Answer 2

The fact of the matter is:

A gasoline-powered car can't run on anything other than gasoline.  An electric car can (indirectly) run on coal, or wind, or solar, or nuclear, etc.  So yes, if you live in an area where your power grid isn't very green, your electric car won't be very green.  But the power grid is getting greener as time goes by, so to quote something I heard on a talk show the other day, "your electric car's dirtiest day will be the day you drive it home from the lot".

In the US, an electric car running today will likely produce less indirect emissions than the amount of direct emissions a gas-powered car produces, but I'm sure even that is not true everywhere currently.

Answer 3

You're all forgetting about the battery.

What do you do with it when it expires in 5-7 years. And at what cost.

What kind of emmissions and other pollutants are caused by the manufacture process of lithium-ion batteries in third world countries?

Oh, is it ok if other countries pollute 'their' land and air on your dime?

The worlds polluted water eventually flows to your tap.



The world's polluted air eventually wafts by your nose...

Zero emmission my a**

Answer 4

It is a very good point. However, it is a small step.  Even if the way we produce energy remains the same, there are other benefits.  

Car pipes produce quite a bit pollution.  If you take all that smog off the road, it would have a pretty significant environmental positive effect.  

The energy companies will catch up on the clean energy aspects, but electric cars are a good thing, the sooner the better.

Answer 5

A Zero Emission Vehicle (ZEV), as defined by the California Air Resources Board, is a vehicle that meets the emission limits through 120,000 miles of life of zero grams of emissions per mile for NOx, NMOG, CO, PM, and HCHO.  Some vehicles qualify for the Partial Zero Emission Vehicle (PZEV) rating, which at 120,000 miles of life the vehicle emits no more than (in grams per mile) 0.02 of NOx, 0.010 of NMOG, 1.0 of CO, 0.01 of PM, and 0.004 of HCHO, plus have a fully-sealed zero-emission fuel system (no evaporative emissions) and a 10-year/150,000 mile emissions warranty.  All of these listed emissions are for local air quality (smog-forming emissions).  For a detailed chart of the emission limits, see:  http://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/detaile...

Depending on the source for electricity in your area, a BEV (battery electric vehicle) may or may not put out more greenhouse gas emissions than a 55MPG HEV (hybrid electric vehicle). Mainly, if the primary source for electricity in your area is coal, a HEV is cleaner than a BEV running on coal-powered electricity. However, if your electricity source is natural gas, the BEV is usually cleaner than the HEV (depending on the method used for natural gas->electricity conversion), and it gets even better for the BEV if you are using a hydroelectric or other renewable electric source. In comparisons with a generic 17MPG SUV, an average 26MPG vehicle, and a high-efficiency 38MPG vehicle, the 38MPG vehicle still will beat the coal-powered BEV, but isn't as clean as the HEV (and gas and renewables powered BEVs are much better than the 38MPG vehicle).

see: "Battery-Powered Electric and Hybrid Electric Vehicle Projects to Reduce Greenhouse Gas Emissions: A Resource Guide for Project Development," July 2002

http://www.netl.doe.gov/products/ccps/pu...

http://www.eere.energy.gov/cleancities/i...

mainly section 4.3

(and that's besides the arguements that it's easier to manage emissions from a handful of electric plants, as opposed to millions of independently-owned cars... typically, electric charging rates (especially the off-peak charging times which would use otherwise lost power and level the loads) are still cheaper than petroleum rates, too. Of course, there are still emissions to worry about other than just greenhouse gas emissions, too.)

more info on US electric power generation, source mix, and rates, can be found here:  http://www.eia.doe.gov/fuelelectric.html

Answer 6

It's all about efficiency.

It's not emissions "less" but it is substantially less emissions, mostly due to the fact that the electricity is centrally generated at a power plant(hopefully not a coal fired plant), and easily transported over existing infrastructure, without using more energy.... as opposed to any other "fuel", which would have to be shipped out via truck, boat, etc.

Electric motors in general are up to 95% efficient in converting electricity into work.  A combustion engine has too many losses...

Electricity is the purest form of useable energy....and any conversion of electricity into anything else other than work, is less efficient.(e.g. Hydrogen) It's as close to zero emission that will ever be possible or practical.

Answer 7

If an electric car emits nothing while you drive it, that’s great for your local air. But the fact of the matter is, if it requires you to plug in to an energy source, unless you can be sure that your local power is derived from clean energy sources (i.e. solar, wind power, etc,) all you’re really doing is offsetting the emissions to that power plant. Your car may emit no CO2, but, for example, the coal power plant that provides your neighborhood and thus your car with energy sure does.  

Answer 8

The amount of electricity required to charge say a chevy volt. Would be something on the order of $0.35 per day

Answer 9

Good point.If the charger drew 4 amps per hour and you recharged every nightfor 8hours it would be,32amps x 110 volts =440 watts x.15 per watt = $6.60 per charge.x30 days=$198.00 per month and thats what I pay for gas now.So,in the real world how much emissions are produced from the production of this much power? h**l,I don`t know.Maybe nuclear power would be the only clean fuel to do this.

Answer 10

well remember they have taken energy to be built and for now rely on a fossil fuel controlled power network. but it doesn't have to stay like that, the cars will become more efficient and more of the power on the grid will be produced by greener (read: less polluting) sources.

So in time electric cars will be very clean, just not at the mo.....  

Answer 11

It's zero emissions as long as you charge your car with hydro, wind, solar, or equivalent.  We need electric cars and we need clean power too!

Answer 12

Electricity in the US comes mainly from coal, so an electric car will pollute slightly more than an gasoline car.  He is an analogy.  You own a big dog, you take it for a walk and let it do its business in someone else's yard, then you come back home and say you have the cleanest best dog, that dog is a chevy volt or a Honda Fuel Cell car.

The Chevy volt cost anywhere from $.05 to $.15 per mile to drive, not $.35/day.  The latest diesels will cost from $.09 to $.15 and gasoline cars from $.10 to $.18 per mile.