In Tae Kwon do, does a 15-yr. old Black Belt have a right to tell a 21-yr. old Blue Belt what to do?

Question

I'm 24 right now. 3 yrs. ago, I was taking TKD, & I also used to take it when I was 5-8 yrs. old. All my life, I was taught that with the discipline & stuff, authority goes by RANK. But in this case, age is an issue. So, does a 15-yr. old Black Belt have a right to tell a 21-yr. old Blue Belt what to do? I mean, do I "have" to do what a 15-yr. old tells me to do if the belt rank is higher? If so, that sucks!

I suffer Tourette's & 1 day, I had a tic, & the 15-yr. old girl got in my face & said, "Look straight ahead. Don't look the other way." I wanted to cuss her @$$ out! That was very hard to refrain from doing, but successfully, I didn't curse her. & trip part is, the girl ALWAYS hated my guts for no d**n reason, & she never bossed the other adults around who were green belts & stuff.

I want to know for future reference. I wish to get back into TKD to help me lose weight & get in shape. But if I have to be mistreated like this, then it's not worth it.

Answer 1

I'd speak to the head instructor about this matter. Personally I don't think a 15 year old should be telling anyone else what to do unless they are in charge of children. Which is another matter I'm not fond of either.  

Traditionally in the orient black belt requires at least a minimum age of 16. So we have an issue here already.

Best to speak to the head instructor and find out what is to be expected of you. Then there will be no surprises.

Good Luck!

Answer 2

technachly yes!

im an 18 year old black belt in tae kwon do and i have been training for 7 tears. when i was only 16 there was a kid who was8 and i had to listen to what ever he said because he was higher rank than ,e . the who thing comes into prespection as respect your instructors and seniors. so he should treat u with the same respect u treat him.

Answer 3

Most martial arts are this way:

If a student outranks you, they are your senior. You don't -have- to listen to her. Respect is earned by behavior, not what belt holds your pants up.

Explain that it's a tic, that you can't control it, and if she has a problem with it she can speak to you and the head of the school after class. Stay calm and be stronger.

The way that the senior students behave isn't always good. I've always had the attitude that the way a senior student behaves should reflect their personal level of control: if they only deal with people that don't fall in line with their view by yelling at them, they're insecure with themselves. A sempai has a responsibility to help and guide, not shout orders.

Ultimately, you're there for you, not for them. Smirk and give them the look of "If you do anything, I'm going to hurt you and enjoy it." It usually changes their attitude. If not, listen, then do what you want.

Answer 4

A instructor is suppose to guide not order his/her students, it sounds like this 15 year old black belt was and maybe still is on a power trip and wants to order everyone around.

As the other people have said respect is earned not given and I totally agree with that. If she does not like you that is her problem not yours do not let it effect you. If she has another go at you explain your situation and if she does not take that into account then tell her to jam her order up her .... and go above her head and tell the lead instructor. If he/she does not pull the girl into line then I suggest you find another school to go too. You are there to study and learn a Martial Art not to get yelled at and abused.

Answer 5

Your situation sucked.  That 'instructor' needed to be brought down a notch, but you are correct in thinking that the person to do that is NOT you.  That attitude is not appropriate for any student/teacher relationship, but it makes it even worse when the "teacher" is the younger person.

To start with your question - yes, the Black Belt has the right to tell a Blue Belt what to do.  This assumes that the Black Belt has been given that authority from the Sr. Instructor/school owner.  Respect should be given because of rank, but it should also take into consideration age.  The instructor should have treated you with the respect that is due any adult from a teenager.

For future reference, if you ever find yourself in this situation again (which is highly likely, if not almost certain), talk it over with the ranking instructor on the floor, or the school owner if they are not the same.  Let them deal with the ego of the teenager.  We have ways of bringing people down a notch without destroying their credibility or boosting your ego in the process.

Answer 6

if you are concerned about rank then find a style where your rank is determined by your ability, not your legth of stay and belts accurately reflect one's skill.

or just find an art that doesn't use rank and your status is determined by your skill.

Answer 7

'stslavik' has taken the words out of my mouth again!

Have you also considered telling the head instructor of your dojang about your syndrome, as I'm certain that most respectable instructors would make reasonable allowances for their student's conditions etc.

Respect is earned, not given.  Good luck!

Answer 8

In general and Technique vise especialy the high rank person is in charge.  That doesn't mean they are right or know what they are talking about!  The way it works is YOU choose an instructor or leader to follow and then you offer your loyalty and you disipline in exchange for what the leader provides you with

There can't be a pack leader without a pack, if the leader treated their pack like c**p he will be thrown out on his own while the pack finds a new leader.  Same thing here, your going to have to follow someone regardless of their age but you dont have to follow someone YOU don't like, just find a new school or dont go on the days they are teaching, if your going to learn from that person then you should do what they say but its your choice WHO you learn from

Answer 9

First let me appolagize for the Martial Arts community on the way you were treated. Abuses like this make me very angry. As stated above it sounds like this girl was on a power trip and you paid the price.

Please do not let this one incident keep you from pursuing the Martial Arts, whichever one you decide on. Make sure that wherever you start that the main Instructor knows about your condition, and what are some of the things that might go on if you have an attack. Make sure that he lets all of the other instructors know also. He should be willing to work with you.

As for respect I actually feel that there are two types of respect in a Martial Arts class.

1) Automatic Respect for the Belt- Somebody that is wearing a higher ranked belt then you should automaticly be given a certian level of respect because of their higher rank. This means no arguing and correcting them in front of other students, adn no bad mouthing them to other students. Ifyou have a problem with them it should be adressed away from other students or discussed with the instructor.

2) Earned respect- this is much more valuble then the first type of respect. This is the respect that they are not entitled to, that you choose to show to somebody because of the way they conduct and carry themselves with others, and is contingent upon the amount of respect they show you.

I only care for the first type of respect in that it helps in not having the person in charge's authority challenged in front of the class. For me I would much rather have the second type of respect, because if you do, the first type is already there willingly, and not just an obligation the student has.

Answer 10

Yes.  A black belt can tell a blue belt what do, regardless of age.  I was instructed by 16 and 17 year old black belts when I did Okinawan Karate.  And guess what?  I learned a lot.  You're too hung up on age.

Answer 11

yes you can tell him what to do age doesnt really matter when it comes to this you are the more experienced one your in charge.

Answer 12

There are some great answers here, and as a general rule of thumb the higher rank "if given that right" has the authority. But with that being said, common courtesy and respect should still be observed and practiced regardless of rank. Which brings me to another point when it comes to very young children or teenagers given a black belt. Like the old corny saying goes "With great power, comes great responsibility", in that with younger black belts like a 15 yr old kid can tend to forget the basic rules of courtesy and respect to all others. Not understanding that just because you have the higher rank doesn't mean they have the right to abuse it. I find this to be not uncommon with young black belts, they get an over whelming sense of entitlement and feel the need to show it. I remember seeing this first hand with a 20 yr old black belt in my school hip toss a grown adult who was fixing their uniform while we were lining up. I felt disrespect and I wasn't even the one being thrown and this wasn't the first such incident I observed with this young man. Definitely a case of power going to ones head. This was delt with off the mat and unfortunately the young black belt left the school because he failed to understand what he was doing wrong. If this is a common pattern with this person in your school then you do need to address it with the school's head master first, off the mat. A good master will remind the youngster that respect and curtesy should never take a back seat to rank on or off the mat.

Answer 13

You just described a major problem with awarding dan ranks to children.Even some adults have a problem with it .

Courtesy to all respect is earned is the best procedure.

Answer 14

I don't have a lot of respect for schools that give black belts out under 16.  The minimum age at my school is 16 and in practice only a few very intelligent and athletic 17 y/o's have taken the test.  All three passed, that is three 17 y/o's in 15 years of training there.  One of the 17 y/o graduated high school a year early and was already attending UC Berkley when she took her black belt test.

Find another school that has enough respect for the black belt to say children aren't mature enough emotionally or physically to hold that rank.