Is capitalism the solution for Global Warming?

Question

Texas oil billionaire T. Boone Pickens is no liberal tree-hugging flake (nor an attention seeking politician), but he is a very smart man who recognizes the reality of global warming. And it appears that like any good moral capitalist (not all capitalists are moral and not all moral people are capitalists), he's finding a way to both help solve the problem AND earn some money.

Given the glacier-like speed toward action by the worlds politicians, do others think this kind of big money investing by private sector capitalists is the solution to global warming? Or is it at least a very encouraging first step?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080418/us_nm/usa_oil_pickens_wind_dc;_ylt=AgHVpsmyz5GEwI5hzjuovZis0NUE

Answer 1

well it looks like we are going to find out. the 'cap and trade' system has been a fiasco so far, cheers american delegation to kyoto, insist on your capitalist 'solution' then run away huh!

i would quote someone; the market is a good tool, but a terrible master....

we need regulation and international agreements whatever the mechanisms chosen. and we know we can do it, after the successes of the antarctic and montreal treaties.

Answer 2

T. Boone Pickens made a smart investment.  Electric rates averaged $89 per MW-h in the US in 2006.  The current spot price is $93.  The article does not state whether the 4000 MW are peak or average power.  One has to assume that Pickens did his homework and the wind turbines will operate at peak at least half of the time.  This means at least $1.8  billion in revenue at current prices.  That is enough to cover the cost of capital and there is a lot of upside.  The wind won't cost any more in 5 years, but the price of energy could be a lot higher than it is now.  The US needs about 780,000 MW to cover peak demand at present.  Pickens 4000 MW is a step in the right direction but 200 similar projects are needed to solve the problem.  If Pickens makes a good profit, more investors will follow his example and the 200 projects needed will get built.

Answer 3

Not *the* solution, no.  The next step in the denial movement after they finally accept AGW is to argue we need to let the free market regulate carbon emissions.  That's essentially been our solution so far, and CO2 emissions have continued to rise.

While capitalism can play some role in reducing our emissions due to intelligent investments like this oil guy building wind farms, we still need to take much greater strides to sufficiently reduce our emissions.  Government regulation will be necessary.

Answer 4

"Green" or environmentally friendly, or rational management of the environment are always very good business and very profitable.  The lie that they are costly and anti capitalistic is one of the standard propaganda lines of those mentally and/or financially invested in the obsolete, filthy, poison producing technology that is used by the laziest of capitalists to bleed the consumers of the world white.

Answer 5

I'd say 'Yes'. Capitalism is the means by which everything gets done. There's no pure capitalism mind you, but that's how it has to happen, if it's going to happen. I have a friend who's a patent attorney. I don't believe in AGW and neither does he. But he says he has a lot of idea's coming across his desk to lower or eliminate carbon from various aspects of our commercial world, that all need to be patented.

Answer 6

If you are asking whether solving our environmental problems will be good for our economy, the answer is a resounding YES.

There are some who use "greenwashing" to appear to be concerned about the environment, with their real incentive being economic.

There are others who are aware enough to understand that it is just plain good business sense, and who understand that the solutions will be a boost to the economy, because they are sustainable, and don't waste as much resources or energy.  



It depends also on the type of capitalism we embrace.  Our current consurmerism on steroids brand of capitalism is the most wasteful and destructive economy imaginable.  We can have the conveniences of a modern lifestyle, without the constant need for bigger and bigger and more and more stuff that we then throw away within six months.  This is a type of group insanity.

  To learn more see the video: The Story of Stuff

http://www.storyofstuff.com/

And here's a new book that shows the positive side to alternative energy and consevation

http://www.earththesequel.com./

"Krupp and Horn have turned the doom and gloom of global warming on its head. "Earth: The Sequel" makes it crystal clear that we can build a low-carbon economy while unleashing American entrepreneurs to save the planet, putting optimism back into the environmental story."

Michael Bloomberg, Mayor of New York City



And the following has sensible ideas about achieving energy independence with current technology.

http://www.setamericafree.org/blueprint....

A Blueprint For U.S. Energy Security

The idea that solving the environmental and global warming problem will ruin the economy are hogwash.  That kind of disinformation is spouted by those with vested interests in continuing with the same wrong thinking that caused these problems.

"Like nuclear plants, coal plants tie up great gobs of capital during their extended construction periods. For the sponsors of such projects, the shifting sands of economic uncertainty can spell financial disaster, as many a utility learned the hard way during nuclear's fiscal meltdown."

"In contrast, solar, wind, and conservation all have shorter lead times, a fiscal advantage not sufficiently appreciated, especially in uncertain economic environments like the present. So in addition to loving these options for being "green," planners can also love them for being "just in time."

http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2008/3/...

Here's an example of a simple cheap solution to save ocean freighters 10-30% of their fuel costs.

Parasails that provide 6800hp of power assist to ships.  The cost of retrofitting a ship is about what it costs to lease a large bulk carrier ship for two days.

http://www.skysails.info/index.php?id=20...

http://www.kiteship.com/

A website showing how plug in hybrids would give the average American driver 100mpg with current technology:

http://www.pluginpartners.org/

Green Wombat

http://blogs.business2.com/greenwombat/

Good site about alternative energy, clean tech etc.  Several articles about progress with solar thermal power plants in California, Arizona and Nevada.

Scientific American  A Solar Grand Plan

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-so...  

Shows how the U.S. electric grid could be 69% solar by 2050, spending way less public money than we now give oil companies in subsidies.  And less than we spent on the high speed information highway over about the same timeframe or 35 years.

My problem is not with capitalism, but with the  

political influence of large corporations in our policy making and election process. Without that undue influence, we would have had an energy bill last December that took $20 billion in subsidies from the oil companies to apply to extending the alternative energy tax credits another 8 years.

The subsidies for alternative energy are miniscule compared with that for fossil fuels and nuclear.

The bill currently in congress to extend the alternative tax credits is not an exception.  It's still a drop in the bucket compared with oil company subsidies.

In the past, big subsidies were used for technologies that were for the future, like railroads, rural electrification, the high speed information highway etc.  So where is the political will to take steps for our future?   Sold out to the oil companies who had record profits last year.

The top 5 oil companies made $123 billion in 2007, while we pay higher and higher gas prices.

Here's how much we are missing the boat by letting our energy policy be dictated by oil companies and others with similar interests.

"Abu Dhabi is not content to just sell you the oil that fuels your SUV; now its going to sell you sunshine to keep your lights on and power your electric car when the internal combustion engine goes the way of the buggy whip. Masdar, the oil-rich emirate’s $15 billion renewable energy venture, and Spanish technology company Sener on Wednesday announced a joint venture called Torresol Energy to build large-scale solar power plants in Australia, Europe, the Middle East, North Africa and the United States."

"Torresol initially will invest $1.2 billion in three solar power plants to be built in Spain but the company is targeting the global “sunbelt” for future expansion. Masdar will take a 60 percent ownership stake in Torresol with Sener holding a 40 percent stake. A Torresol spokesman declined to reveal the dollar amount of the investment. A prime market for Torresol will be the U.S. desert Southwest, where companies like Ausra, BrightSource Energy, Solel and Abengoa Solar are competing for contracts with utilities PG&E (PCG), Arizona Public Service (PNW) and Southern California Edison (EIX). Torresol potentially could shake up that market, given its very deep pockets and ability to independently finance billion-dollar solar power plants."

"The venture is just the latest move by Abu Dhabi to control what Masdar CEO Sultan Ahmed Al Jaber described to Green Wombat recently as “the whole value chain” of renewable energy, from research and development to manufacturing silicon for solar cells to the large-scale deployment of green technology."

"The irony is too rich to leave unsaid: A leading oil producer invests billions in carbon-free energy while a leading consumer of fossil fuels - the United States - continues to subsidize Big Oil  while offering only tepid support for green technology. It is inevitable that climate change will foster the rise of renewable energy - the only question is which countries and companies will profit from the new energy economics. It is entirely possible that the U.S. will trade energy dependence of one kind - on Middle East oil - for another - on Middle East and European solar technology - in the era of global warming. It’s no coincidence that most of the solar energy companies with contracts to build utility-scale power plants in California and the Southwest have overseas roots - Ausra hails from Australia, BrightSource was founded by American-Israeli pioneer Arnold Goldman, Solel is based in Israel and Abengoa is headquartered in Spain."          from Green Wombat

Answer 7

He's got the money and resources, along with initiative. What do we have?...higher tax's and prices. "Use the logic Luke".

Answer 8

The economy is a subset of the environment.

The entire economy is a giant Ponzi scheme based on the future value of resources.

Capitalism does not protect the environment. Capitalism rewards people for exploiting the environment.

The fundamental motivation of a capitalist is self enrichment.

There are finite resources in the world so self enrichment is always at the expense of someone else.

Currently, we enrich ourselves artificially faster by stealing resources from the future. This is called "growth".

Inequity and poverty (both the excess consumption by the few and desperate consumption by the many) are causing great environmental harm.

The ends never justify the means.

Fundamentally, the answer is no.

We must have self determination, but for the sake of the environment

(and therefore our economy and ultimately our society)

it must be within the framework of a just, equitable, sustainable, steady state economy.

Answer 9

People can talk about climate change all they want, man has nothing to do with it.  The windmill is a great idea to lower energy cost to the public, but there are no many environmentalist and wealthy b******s that will fight against the windmill.  The rich will come out complaining they are an eyesore and the greens will come up with some wacky BS about being environmental unfriendly.  As long as special interest controls our elected government nothing is going to change that will help the working American say a little money.

Answer 10

Absolutely, he has every incentive to get results, when is the last time a government program solved anything?  The government is self serving and has no incentive to solve anything.

Answer 11

Judging by the posts I see on this forum the capitalism solution for Global Warming is to pretend it doesn't exist.

Answer 12

THE solution?  No way.  We need a lot more.  A useful PART of a solution?  Sure.