Question:

Is the Conscience proof of creation and not evolution?

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Animals don't have a conscience, they have instinct.

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  1. No, evolution explains a "conscience".


  2. Well then surely the toaster is proof of creation also. Animals don't have toasters, you see.

    Even if we accept your premise that conscience is exclusive to humans, there is no reason why humans possessing a unique trait should suggest an intelligent creator.

  3. "Animals don't have a conscience" - Of course they do.  That's why gorillas live in familys and not kill each other.

  4. Animals don't have a conscience, they have instinct?

    Man has both, and I do not think you can back up your contention. I think the evidence suggests at least most animals above the very simple stage do have consciences.

    My assessment, no proof either way.

  5. That's what the Bible pretty much says in Romans 2:14-15.

  6. No.  Actually conscience really is nothing more than different types of instinct with both genetic and cultural causes.  If you want to talk about animals and conscience, at this stage it is well documented that some primates such as chimpanzees have every single basic characteristic of our own conscience and all animals have their own types, with social groups being the greatest evolutionary driving force.

    Conscience and morality have been well studied in cognitive evolution and they are, in my opinion, the last great "gap" that requires a god to fill.  No longer.

  7. Romans 1 tells us we can know of God by looking at creation.  

    Truth, like whether or not there was a creation, comes from God.  Man is unable to know that truth.  We are dependent upon God for truth.

  8. Sort of but not... Evolution formed from the creation.

    Give something an environment and nurture its growth, we have evolution.  

  9. Yet humans are amongst the only animals on Earth to kill each other on purpose.

    Besides, having a conscience is evolutionarily beneficial - if you do something to harm the group then you damage it's survival, and therefore your own chances of survival.  

  10. Not remotely.

    And animals certainly have consciences.  How do you think communities function.

  11. consciousness is a human construct. It's a concept humans created in order to explain certain thoughts and actions that most animals that are social and live in communities also posses. Are you sure apes don't have a conscience?? Are you sure....????

  12. We all have instinct. Some other animals seem to have conscience and self awareness. Elephants, Whales, Dolphins.  

  13. No, because many animals have various levels of consciousness.  Ultimately it is only our technology that "separates" us from other animals.

    We also have some instinctual behaviors.

  14. I'm assuming you "know" animals don't have a conscience based on your years of professional research in animal behavior and psychology rather than some self aggrandizing presumption. Right?

    *sigh* two points.


  15. We are animals, thereby negating your argument.

  16. As soon as Christians develop a conscience, I'll consider your question...

    =0)

  17. You haven't seen my wife's Corgi when he piddles on the floor.

    .

  18. No, if anything it proves evolution.

  19. That's not even evidence, much less proof.  You couldn't even define conscience in any meaningful way, scientificially, particularly in realtive terms to lower animals.

  20. No, I think.  And I doubt some animals don't have conscience.

    Since you like this subject I recommend you the books of Steven Pinker.

    Check a little bit about him here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Pink...

    Then enjoy the reading.

    Good Luck!

  21. I stopped believing that animals don't have consciences when my dog returned the uneaten portion of the loaf of banana bread she stole. She laid it at my feet and stood there with her head down and her tail between her legs.

  22. and we are animals so....

  23. We are animals.

  24. You assume animals are less than humans b/c your holy book tells you that your god made humans superior to all "the beasts".

    In fact, human behavior can be shown to duplicate, in kind, the exact behaviors of animals that you would relegate to the base level of "instinct."

    Conscientious behavior is simply another mechanism that evolved in humanity to allow human society to function w/o all of us running around and killing each other. And given the dearth of such conscientiousness among the religious communities across the globe, I'd say it's proof of evolution rather than creation.


  25. yes!!

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