Is this a McTang Soo Do Club?

Question

I've just pulled my 11 year old son out of a club in Redcar near Middlesbrough because of my worries about the club.

We enrolled our son in a Tang Soo Do club. It seemed decent and well run. However, we noticed that all the top grades were from the same family. The club was run by two black belts who were brothers, their younger brother and three cousins were also black belts as was their dad. Their mum ran the club. I know that sounds nothing bad, it is other points that worried us. Everyone must call the instructors 'Sir' (regardless of age), everything (and I mean everything) costs money . You MUST grade and attend a seminar with the visiting 'Master' every couple of months. At these visits they do a grading and I have never seen someone fail. They only ever compete in their own association events. It is really creepy, even the mother and father and uncles call the 20 years old instructors 'Sir' even out of class.

You also have to pay by direct debit.

Am I being too picky?

Answer 1

The reason that the family may be at the top may be because they all rose to that rank, moved, and started there own school, I've seen that happen. The reason they call someone sir is because the person is a higher belt. I've seen someone who was a 32-year old white belt call a 15 year old (he started very young) sir. The reason for this was for respect in the fact that the younger man had more knowledge than the beginner. As to the money, that's just business. Almost all Karate styles cost money because besides taking up time, equipment, and other expenses, it is truly a business. In my own style when our grand masters and other high members come to visit we are encourage to come and put on a good show. that is for two reasons, to pay respect, learn something new, and to honestly just show off for our teacher. as far as I know most styles stick to their own to show support or because of style and rules differences.

OUTSIDE CLASS, things are more relaxed and although I don't call my Juniors sir, I am still polite and courtes.

If it feels to strict or creepy, that's is the instructors teaching style. My teacher is a very relaxed, calm, friendly, family man who is been known to be very kind to family's that cannot pay on time. Also we only bow once when we come in and thats it and I only call him sir outside class because while I am only 16, he is a full adult, although he wouldn't say anything if I didn't, but I make a point to due to the great respect I have for him.

If you don't like the teaching, prices, or practices, then seeing how it is your money, you have all the right to back out.

Answer 2

This part is cool, actually:

"We enrolled our son in a Tang Soo Do club. It seemed decent and well run. However, we noticed that all the top grades were from the same family. The club was run by two black belts who were brothers, their younger brother and , three cousins were also black belts as was their dad. Their mum ran the club. I know that sounds nothing bad, it is other points that worried us. Everyone must call the instructors 'Sir' (regardless of age),"

This part is bad:

" everything (and I mean everything) costs money . You MUST grade and attend a seminar with the visiting 'Master' every couple of months."

" At these visits they do a grading and I have never seen someone fail."  This may not be bad because I know when I assisted, we would never have someone test for a belt if we know he or she is going to fail.  It was rare for someone to fail, also.  The person pretty much had to fail themselves:

" At these visits they do a grading and I have never seen someone fail."  

This, unfortunately, is all too common in the martial arts, regardless of style:  " They only ever compete in their own association events."  By staying with the schools they know, they can ensure safety.

" It is really creepy, even the mother and father and uncles call the 20 years old instructors 'Sir' even out of class."

This is not necessarily a bad thing.  Nothing wrong with discipline and respect.  I suspect you may be too hung-up on age.  Would it be ok if the teachers are over 50?  You know, someone besides the baby boomer generation can show some leadership, confidence and competence in the world.

Now this part is suspect:  "You also have to pay by direct debit."    Remember, the school is a business that must keep its lights on, air conditioned, floors waxed, etc.  Schools draw up contracts because there are way too many flaky people who will quit on you once they realize that they will not become a super-ninja in six months.

"Am I being too picky?"

Possibly.  You're too picky about the respect shown to 20 year olds and about the school being a family business.  You're not picky about mandatory testing.  No one should be forced to test.   The seminars are actually a good thing, because they sound like an effort at quality control.  But, if there are too many fees floating around for your comfort, move on.

Personally, I would not put an 11 year old in a contractual situation for martial arts because kids are way too fickle.  Yes, I'm shooting myself in the foot here because I'd like my own dojo one day, but the truth is the truth.  There are way too many cheaper options for a kid to get a black belt, like a rec center or YMCA.  However, if the kid is serious, and I mean the kid has been training for at least two years and is still excited, then and only then would I look at contracts.  

We build up the 1st degree black belt too much in the US.  I think that if your kid can earn one of those from a rec center or something and still wants more, then go to a contract school.

Answer 3

Yes it is McDojang.  The "Sir" c**p is ridiculous.  Contracts are a red herring as are not competing in open tournaments.  Find another school or program at a YMCA, church, community center, etc.

Answer 4

Well yes and no !

Every school will have there own way of doing things and names for each other...But YES, when school do grading and not ONE kid ever fails that doesn't look good to me !  Next time you go there look around and see how many "Black Belts" there is I bet you there will be a bunch and LOTS of them will be under 17...I don't think its right to give a Black Belt to 6-15 year old...It's just not right, they don't even understand them selfs so, how can they understand an ART and carry a black belt.............That's a MC DOJO !

Answer 5

If this is part of the organisation I think it is then you are right that it is McDojo. The quality of their grades are c**p. My wife's sister asked us to watch her grade and it was terrible. They were supposed to be very tradditional with a photograph of the chief instructor and the korean flag at the front. They did not have time for ground fighting because a grappler would not get near them (they said). Respect is one thing but when you see people getting grades just for turning up it makes you doubt the quality of the black belts. Lots of money going in to the organisation though so someone is getting rich.

My sisterinlaw was told she had to grade and attend the seminars. She had to buy hadges, books, and other stuff.

Worst but was that the black belts (2nd dan) were not as good as karate brown belts. We went to pick her up from her class one night and they were sparring. They had a new student who was a kick boxer (i think) and they tried to show off. He beat them every time and so they went in harder and when he did the same they disqualified him.

We got her to join the local Wado Ryu club instead Id get your son to do the same. Hes well out of it.

Edit

***********************

I just did a searach for redcar tang soo do and found only one club which is WTSDA which is what I thought. I love a quote by the instructor

"Tang Soo Do is a not-for-fighting Korean martial art which aims to equip practitioners with the techniques and the development of spirit for the use of the art form as self defence."

ROFLMAO! That organisation is just a money making francise of the worst kind. Hooking kids in to competitions and gradings so their mums and dads waste money. At least d**k Turpin had the desency to wear a mask.

Answer 6

I feel for you, I have had a similar experience

Now I teach Kempo Karate, ppl don't call me sir

No bowing to a flag and that other nonsense.

Try to get your child into another school, walk away

from that money pit. Find out if they have a club through your child's elementary school. My school has one, I run it the students study for free, without the weirdness