Jehovahs witness's and ex Jw's?

Question

In a previous question a Jehovah witness said this "Even the Watchtower understands this because they have stated that if anyone reads the BIBLE alone, they will believe the same things Christendom believes." (this is copy and pasted because I do not know how to provide the link to the question)

Am I reading this right? A Jw is discouraged against reading the bible without the help of the publications the Watchtower puts out? I thought they lived by what the bible says not what they are told it says.

Can someone please explain this statement to me.

Answer 1

Exactly!

Jehovah's Witnesses seem to forget that former JW's were there! We know what its all about. We know that the WT is the main sorce of their beliefs and information. How long is the public talk verse the WT study...Hmmm..are they studing the Bible or the WT.

Answer 2

Not an xJW.

Let us examine how this is written, I will break down the article:

The Watchtower 8/15/81, page 28-29

"From time to time, there have arisen from among the ranks of Jehovah’s people those who, like the original Satan, have adopted an independent, faultfinding attitude.

1. << If a person finds an error a person is like Satan? >>

2. << If a person is independant they are like Satan? >>

3. << Who is "the original Satan"? >>

4. << This states that a person is Satan if they find a error (fault) with the WT teachings? >>

5. << This states that a person must be dependent and a dependant (on the Watchtower) rather than  independant. >>

_______

They do not want to serve “shoulder to shoulder” with the worldwide brotherhood. (Compare Ephesians 2:19-22.)

1. << Eph 2:21  In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: >>

2. << The Watchtower does not teach the indwelling of the Holy Spirit by all members, only 144,000 have the anointing(as the WT calls it) and only the Governing body is the channel. >>

3. << Here the Watchtower is applying something that their own doctrine claims is for the few but being applied to the whole. >>

_______

Rather, they present a “stubborn shoulder” to Jehovah’s words. (Zech. 7:11, 12)

1. << Zechariah 7 is about listening to the prophet. >>

2. << The Watchtower does not claim to be a prophet so this verse is being misapplied. >>

3. << Zech. 7:11 talks about stopped ears. Many cult like groups whose doctrine can not withstand scrutiny discourage independant study and understanding. They want a person to close their minds to outside info and only listen to them.>>

4. << Zech. 7:12 talks about law and the heart. Some groups push works based theology among these is the Watchtower. Christians know that “I will put my law within them, and in their heart I shall write it.” (Jeremiah 31:31-34) This is Grace and works are the result of Grace. >>

_______

Reviling the pattern of the “pure language” that Jehovah has so graciously taught his people over the past century,

1. << The WT has many changes in doctrine and what is taught today is quite different from what was taught 100 years ago. >>

2. << "Graciously" is a loaded word and leads back to a works based theology. The sentence with the word "graciously" in it works toward seeking "approval" of the leaders by the students.

3. << "Pure language"? What does "Pure language" mean? This walks the line between the gift of tongues which the WT teaches against and the gift of prophecy which the WT claims not to do. >>

_______

I'll stop here on this but I think the asker gets the idea of what the Watchtower publishes and the method of writing.

The full pargraph below:

The Watchtower 8/15/81, page 28-29

"From time to time, there have arisen from among the ranks of Jehovah’s people those who, like the original Satan, have adopted an independent, faultfinding attitude. They do not want to serve “shoulder to shoulder” with the worldwide brotherhood. (Compare Ephesians 2:19-22.) Rather, they present a “stubborn shoulder” to Jehovah’s words. (Zech. 7:11, 12) Reviling the pattern of the “pure language” that Jehovah has so graciously taught his people over the past century, these haughty ones try to draw the “sheep” away from the one international “flock” that Jesus has gathered in the earth. (John 10:7-10, 16) They try to sow doubts and to separate unsuspecting ones from the bounteous “table” of spiritual food spread at the Kingdom Halls of Jehovah’s Witnesses, where truly there is ‘nothing lacking.’ (Ps. 23:1-6) They say that it is sufficient to read the Bible exclusively, either alone or in small groups at home. But, strangely, through such ‘Bible reading,’ they have reverted right back to the apostate doctrines that commentaries by Christendom’s clergy were teaching 100 years ago, and some have even returned to celebrating Christendom’s festivals again, such as the Roman Saturnalia of December 25! Jesus and his apostles warned against such lawless ones.—Matt. 24:11-13;"

Answer 3

1.The watchtower Society and JW's Encourage the reading of the Bible daily. It's Written in BIG TALL LETTERS on thw Watchtowr building in NY for all to see. No where in the watchtower publications does it say that you cant read the Bible w/o the watchtower to help. The Bible is Gods word and it is truth anyone sincerely wanting to know the truth will find it in God's word.

2. Just because someone says they are on of JW's does not mean they are, and if he truly is then maybe his words came out wrong.

3. Many of the JW's have been put in concentration camps w/o any literature or the Bible. Eventually they got there hands on a Bible and used it to keep themselves up built. They endured just by having the Bible.  

4. Seeing the answer out of context is hard to explain. Asking the person himself is your best bet.  

Answer 4

The meaning of the quote is that when done only with thoughts and reasonings without real insight, people tend to go back to what they think they know.  What has been told to them for centuries.

This is bad.  It has been Christendom that has been mixing truth with lots of lies for centuries.  Such things as the immortal soul, trinity, pagan holidays renamed as Christian ones, hellfire fears, etc.  None of these things are supported by Bible truth.  Yet people believe them now as if they were part of the first draft of Genesis.

People come across something they do not understand.  Rather than look further and deeper, the overall tendency is to rational as come up with "some" explanation, usually wrong.

JWs in the late 1800s had this problem.  They did not have the bank of data that makes it easier for us today.  It was slow going for them to throw off the sludge of Christendom's lies and half-truths to find the truth of God's Word.  Holy spirit from God helped much, but even Jesus allowed his disciples to learn and make mistakes at their own rate of understanding.

Today we have all sorts of Bible aids, which is all they are--just aids.  None of them replaces the Bible.

Today we have one little book that when used allows the student to get an understanding of the basic truths of the Bible in less than 6 months.  It used to take years.

As for personal study of the Bible, we have beginning next year shortened one of our meetings and put it with another to free up one extra night a week for personal study.  Does that sound like we are slacking in reading and understanding the Bible?  

Answer 5

Our Watchtower magazines are like sermons that help to motivate and encourage us especially in these terrible times we are living in.  Other religions use Bible based aids and ministers do not preach using the Bible alone. They give "sermons" using their own thoughts and ideas and experiences along with God's Word. Have you ever been to a Christian book store and saw how many books and magazines are sold there? And they are from Christendom's major religions.

So why question when we have a publication that helps in our ministry and in our Bible education? Our magazines are printed in every language and distributed earthwide. This is not an easy task and our ministry, the free Bible studies we have with interested ones, and our worldwide preaching work done in over 235 lands could never be accomplished without Jehovah's spirit and blessing.

We are always encouraged to read the Bible daily and to meditate on what we read.

LOBT

Answer 6

Chuck Russell was of the belief that understanding the bible without his publications was impossible, this belief has continued, and JW's rely quite heavily on the watchtower for guidance, but are led to believe that everything in the watchtower is bible based.  I find this questionable, but each to their own, we will all find out in the end if Chuck dude was on to something or if he just smoked too much weed...

Answer 7

You are correct. Here it is from the Watchtower:

The Watchtower 8/15/81, page 28-29

"From time to time, there have arisen from among the ranks of Jehovah’s people those who, like the original Satan, have adopted an independent, faultfinding attitude. They do not want to serve “shoulder to shoulder” with the worldwide brotherhood. (Compare Ephesians 2:19-22.) Rather, they present a “stubborn shoulder” to Jehovah’s words. (Zech. 7:11, 12) Reviling the pattern of the “pure language” that Jehovah has so graciously taught his people over the past century, these haughty ones try to draw the “sheep” away from the one international “flock” that Jesus has gathered in the earth. (John 10:7-10, 16) They try to sow doubts and to separate unsuspecting ones from the bounteous “table” of spiritual food spread at the Kingdom Halls of Jehovah’s Witnesses, where truly there is ‘nothing lacking.’ (Ps. 23:1-6) They say that it is sufficient to read the Bible exclusively, either alone or in small groups at home. But, strangely, through such ‘Bible reading,’ they have reverted right back to the apostate doctrines that commentaries by Christendom’s clergy were teaching 100 years ago, and some have even returned to celebrating Christendom’s festivals again, such as the Roman Saturnalia of December 25! Jesus and his apostles warned against such lawless ones.—Matt. 24:11-13;"

You're like Satan if you read the Bible without the Watchtower publications.

Here is another tidbit:

The Watchtower 7/1/73 pag 402:

"Consider, too, the fact that Jehovah’s organization alone, in all the earth, is directed by God’s holy spirit or active force. (Zech. 4:6) Only this organization functions for Jehovah’s purpose and to his praise. To it alone God’s Sacred Word, the Bible, is not a sealed book. Many persons of the world are very intelligent, capable of understanding complex matters. They can read the Holy Scriptures, but they cannot understand their deep meaning. Yet God’s people can comprehend such spiritual things. Why? Not because of special intelligence on their part, but as the apostle Paul declared: “For it is to us God has revealed them through his spirit, for the spirit searches into all things, even the deep things of God.” (1 Cor. 2:10) Jesus Christ praised his heavenly Father for ‘hiding such things from the wise and intellectual ones but revealing them to babes.’ (Matt. 11:25) How very much true Christians appreciate associating with the only organization on earth that understands the “deep things of God”!"

"the only organization on earth that understands the “deep things of God”!"

Arrogant.

*****EDIT, RICK G. You said "The statement was not that the "Bible only readers" would agree or come to the same conclusion as Christendom, but rather be as indistinct as Christendom which is filled with confusion and misunderstanding."

But the above Watchtower says "But, strangely, through such ‘Bible reading,’ they have reverted right back to the apostate doctrines that commentaries by Christendom’s clergy were teaching 100 years ago, and some have even returned to celebrating Christendom’s festivals again"

Your statement disagrees with you literature.

Answer 8

Let me start with an example from the Bible.

Acts 8:26-40

This is the account of Philip and the Ethiopian.

This man was a proselyte and must have been going back and forth from Ethiopia and Jerusalem. So, he was a devote man. Yet, for all his efforts, he didn't know who Isaiah was writing about. This was after Jesus' death, the pouring out of holy spirit, and the expanison of the preaching to the Samaritans.

When asked by Philip asked if he knew what he was reading, he said “Really, how could I ever do so, unless someone guided me?”

We need that guidance, and especially from someone who is in harmony and working under the direction of the holy spirit.

Now this is a paragraph from the Watchtower.

w83 3/1 p. 25 par. 16 What Is Our Position Toward Opposers of the Truth?

16 Consider some of the other “twisted things” used to mislead God’s people today. On occasion opposers will question the various teachings that Jehovah’s people hold in common. Often this becomes a debate about words, just as it was in the first century. (1 Timothy 6:3, 4) They may also question the need for an organization to direct the minds of God’s people. Their view is, God’s spirit can direct individuals without some central, organized body of men giving direction. They will declare that all one needs to do is to read the Bible. But Christendom has been reading the Bible for centuries. And look at the indistinct trumpet call coming from Christendom today! See the confusion and misunderstanding as to the true message contained in God’s Word! What a contrast this is to the foretold peace and unity among true Christians who not only read the Bible but search out and zealously apply its teachings!—Ephesians 4:3-6.

The statement was not that the "Bible only readers" would agree or come to the same conclusion as Christendom, but rather be as indistinct as Christendom which is filled with confusion and misunderstanding.

The issue you raise is answered by Jesus' words about the 'faithful and discreet slave" which is responible for providing "their food at the proper time". Matthew 24:45,46

In a little town I lived in, I found a study group who believed all the same things as Jehovah's Witnesses. They even held the Memorial at the same time as we did. But they could never progress.

I asked them if they knew who the "faithful and discreet slave" was? They said they hadn't decided, that the main teachers in their group could not come up with an answer. I keep asking for all the decade I lived there.

I keep sharing information with them, but as a group they slowly broke up, never coming to find "that slave."

As the paragraph above says, we accept that God is using only one path of light. If we decide that we don't need to listen to 'that slave' which Jesus has appointed over all his belongings, and can "read the Bible only", we will be like that little group, who straved to death for lack of food.

Answer 9

Trust in Jehovah with all your heart and do not lean upon your own understanding. 6 In all your ways take notice of him, and he himself will make your paths straight.  Proverbs 3:5,6.

The heart of earthling man may think out his way, but Jehovah himself does the directing of his steps.   Proverbs 16:9

I well know, O Jehovah, that to earthling man his way does not belong. It does not belong to man who is walking even to direct his step. 24 Correct me, O Jehovah, however with judgment; not in your anger, that you may not reduce me to nothing.   Jeremiah 10:23.24

We are encouraged to read our bible daily, meditate upon what we have read.  We are discouraged from leaning upon our own understanding.  Before we study the scriptures we pray for direction and guidance.  This prayer is directed to Jehovah God, the author of scripture.  May I encourage you to do the same with these scriptures cited.

Answer 10

Yep! Insrblog already shared the quote with you.

(He and Big Guy 360 are the kings of WT quotes!)

We all know that this WT "warning" was not about Christmas!

The Watchtower is afraid that if their followers start doing independant Bible study, that they might figure out that:

Jesus is God,

Hellfire is real.

1914 is bogus.

144K are Jews.

Salvation doesn't come through an organization.

(These are alledged "apostate doctrines" of centuries past.)

Jesus is "The Lord of me AND the GOD of me!"

I kneel before my Saviour.

Call it worship, call it obeisance....

but it's Biblical, that's for sure!

Answer 11

Yes they want you only reading with their (watchtower) help.

type in Kingdom Hall no more on my space.

Answer 12

We are not discouraged to read the bible. It is our main tool in preaching. So how can we effectively use it if we are not familiar with it? WT literatures serve as aids only.

Read what isnrblog pasted. Those words were for the Christians who refused to work with their brothers shoulder to shoulder as commanded by Eph 2:19-22. So they took an independent course. They tried to convince others that reading the bible alone (no need for shoulder to shoulder work with fellow Christians) is enough. They can go on without being part of any organization but just read the bible is enough. (I don’t know if you agree with it)

Yes reading the bible is really important. But is anyone here ended up with the right conclusion regarding what the bible really teach without receiving any single help from someone?

I believe that all Ex JW who answered were somehow influenced by someone belonging to other religion.  It’s hard to believe that they left JW (or became ex jw) just because they made a PURE bible reading. C’mon guys let’s be honest. Something or someone practically influenced you.  Do you owe it all to pure bible reading? Haven’t you received any advice or info from nonJW?

The article you’ve pasted has been the favorite tool of anti-JWs to mislead others. They keep on insisting that we are discouraged to read the bible.

Answer 13

While JWs do encourage daily reading of their translation of the Bible, a critical part of their religion is interpreting the Bible with their publications.  If, however, you try to cross-reference how they interpret scripture and how a Biblical scholar interprets scripture, you will be at the least looked down upon and at worst reprimanded for listening to apostate propaganda.  

JWs live by what the Watchtower Society tells them the Bible says, not the other way around.  

Answer 14

Rick G himself quoted

w83 3/1 p. 25 par. 16 What Is Our Position Toward Opposers of the Truth?

"They may also question the need for an organization to direct the minds of God’s people. Their view is, God’s spirit can direct individuals without some central, organized body of men giving direction. They will declare that all one needs to do is to read the Bible."

YES!  This is coming from the Watchtower  NOT THE BIBLE!  Can't anyone see that this is brainwashing?  If one is reading this stuff over and over again they are going to believe it!   WHERE in the bible does it say that one needs an organized body of men?   Where!?

Looks like the WBTS wants to keep all bases covered so that anyone who questions, opposes, OR even debates is automatically wrong in the eyes of who?  NOT GOD...the JWs and their "organization"!

Answer 15

Here's some irony for you....

How in the world did Charles Russell, the founder of the Watchtower organizaton,  come to an understanding of the scriptures before he started printing the Watchtower?

How in the world do Governing Body members come up with "new light" BEFORE they print it in the Watchtowers?

So, JW's are supposed to believe that their leaders, who have no special "inspiration", can read the bible ALONE with prayer and come up with "the truth", and yet they themselves can't do it.

What's the point of reading the bible daily JW'S and praying for God's Holy Spirit for understanding, if he simply bypasses you and only gives understanding to a few men in Brooklyn?

Confusing....

Answer 16

I am a former Jw and my personal experience with them was they rely on the publications from the Watchtower to tell  them what to believe.  Yes there are scriptures thrown in everywhere to somehow justify the beliefs but those are usually pulled out of  context like the examples of  the answers given by the Jw here.  

In short the believe what the Watchtower tells them to believe.  Yes there are  many bible aids out there for many religions but in the  other churches I have been to they use the  bible at their "sermons" not the watchtower,  kindom ministry and whatever book they study on tuesday night.