Questions on TKD?

Question

First off, I'm currently in a six week testing program to receive my First Degree Black Belt in American Kenpo Karate which I know is rather different than TKD. So I have a few questions about TKD, particularly on the black belt testing process. My questions are...

*How long does the average TKD Black Belt Testing last? Does it start and end on one day or does it extend into other days, weeks, or months?*Is it possible for someone at the end of a black belt testing to be denied the rank? If so, on what grounds is it possible?

*What is the average time between testings? I realize some students may be faster than others, but black in under 3 years sounds a bit weird to me. So is the 2(1/2) year statistic off, or correct?

*Are TKD students required to learn traditional martial arts weapons such as the Bo Staff, Nunchuks, Sword, ect.?

Thanks for your time. I don't plan on learning TKD, but I'd like to learn as much as I can about other disciplines, especially one so popular.

Answer 1

In our school you first enter a 6 month black belt cycle. Then The actual test is two days long about 10 to 12 hours a day. We separate the two days to be one week apart to allow for recuperation. Many of the parts of the physical testing are done to extinction. That means you do sets until you cannot do another set. The second day of testing Is less physical and focuses on self defense and sparing and forms. Sparing is with padding and head gear and is full contact. I was KO-ed on my 1st Dan test in the third round This taught me an important lesson about blocking, how it should be for real and not half a**  . This of course was the adult level testing 16 years and up.

We teach traditional weapons at our school. We teach bo, jo, And dragon pole, arnise sticks, sith, comas, kubaton, and butterfly sword. We invite seminars on other weapons as well from time to time. Our school is fortunate to also have Wing Chun Kung Fu and we encourage our Black Belts and Yellow Sashes to cross train.

Edit:

IT takes a minimum of three years to get a Black Belt in our school. In two years you will receive a probationary Black Belt and than a First deg. Or first Dan at the end of testing.

It takes one more year to be eligible to test for second Dan. Than two more years to test for third Dan.

We do not require that you train at our school after first Dan for testing. You must of course show the form and demonstrate the ability to do the techniques. The testing fees are reasonable compared to most. for our students it is nominal mostly to pay for the belt the certificate and a small in school party. ~$45.00. For non students testing for high ranks that has to be determined, usually around $200.00 But please don't quote me we haven't done one in a long time.

Answer 2

Having been a former Kenpo student, and then having trained in many places and styles, I can tell you that kenpo is one of the slowest progressing martial arts I've seen.  Kenpo and/or Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu are the slowest.

For example, it may take a Kenpo student 3 years to reach blue belt, but a TKD student can reach blue belt in 1 year.  

As for TKD (WTF Version), for 1st Dan, you have a 1 day test that takes about 4 hours.  You peform with a group of other candidates before a panel of masters.  The first two hours is pretty much all cardio and push ups.  You are required to know 9 forms, 20 "one steps" (Punching Defense), 40 Self Defense (Escapes, etc) and 4 knife defense, 4 gun defense and 10 "blocking sets".  

You have to demonstrate a variety of kicking techniques at the master's discretion.  You must break 1" pine boards, sometimes more than 1 at a time, with a technique of the master's choosing.  You must also know Korean terminology and be prepared to answer several questions such as the meaning of a belt (by color), the meaning of form (by name), the history of TKD, etc.  You do not know which forms you will be asked to do, or which questions you will be asked.  You must be prepared for everything.

Weapons are taught at our school, but they are not required to advance in rank.  

Yes, it is possible to fail the test.  Reasons for failure are the inability to demonstrate competence in all areas.  Most failures result as the candidate just freezes up and forgets things.  They do not have to pay for a re-test, but must wait 6 months.

To go to 2nd Dan, you must take 3 more trial tests that are identical to the one described above, given every 3-6 months.  The reason for this is that they may not cover every aspect at one test, but over the course of 3, everything will be covered.

For 3rd Dan it's 6 trial tests, then confirmation test.

For 4th Dan it's 9 trial tests, then confirmation test.  

It keeps going up from there.

James

Answer 3

First off, congratulations on your progress in Kenpo Karate and good luck with your testing.

I did TKD for about 6 years and got my black belt. But that was mostly because I moved around and trained at 3 different schools, so it took me awhile. But people getting black belts in 3 years or less is not unheard of. Not to bash on the Masters and Grandmasters, I have a lot of respect for them, but the sad fact is that most TKD schools are run just to bring in money.

11 year old kids can join up, and as long as they (more accurately their parents) have the money, they test every 2-4 months (depending on the school) and get a new belt. It goes on like that until they reach black belt. One of the main reasons I stopped was because I got sick of walking in and having to bow to a 15 year old black belt that I could destroy in a sparring match. There's really nothing different from black belt testing compared to other belts, other than the student needs to demonstrate more forms and techniques than previous tests.

TKD doesn't require weapons training, but I've seen some schools that offer sword training too.

Hope that answers your question.

Answer 4

Jeez, Sifu, two days?? You have got to have weapons training in there as well as forms, sparring, and all the knowledge from 10 gup to 1 gup. Sounds pretty intense (I like it!!)

Okay, taking Sifu Franks' answer into consideration, black belt testing can last from one to two days, depending on the program. It Is possible to be denied advancement, at ANY rank, if you are unable to perform to the level required for advancement. And advancement to black belt is not just about knowing the new information you learned as a 1 Gup; you have to know it ALL, from 10 gup on up. Some schools require that you demonstrate your knowledge for EVERYTHING (Frank, I'm guessing you here?), while some schools will randomly select information from different grades to test your knowledge. Simple reasoning: as a black belt, you will likely be called upon to teach newer students. If you don't know it, you can't teach it, plain and simple.

Time between testings will vary, up until you reach 3 gup (in ITF, Blue Belt/Red Stripe). At that point, you should be 1-1/2 years, MINIMUM, from testing for your 1st degree. 6 months per rank from that point on, because the amount of information to absorb and perfect is much greater than at previous ranks. It IS possible to achieve a black belt, legitimately, in 2-1/2 years, but this requires much more frequent training than you normally will experience. Many schools teach two days a week, others offer classes five days a week. In order to advance 8 ranks in one year (10 Gup to 3 Gup, inclusive), you had best be training five days a week, or close to it. The typical time frame to 1st degree is three or more years of good, steady instruction.

Just getting the black belt is not the end of the road, however; at most good, legitimate schools, your first six months at 1st Dan are"probationary" or "recommended". Once you have shown that you intend to continue training past those six months, and continue to uphold the standards of martial arts training, you will then be a "decided" black belt, and will not be at risk of losing your ranking if, for some reason, you choose or are not able to continue training. After that, it's 1 to 1-1/2 years until you test for 2nd Dan, and times stretch out from there. From starting at white belt (10 Gup) to the pinnacle of Tae Kwon Do (9th Degree Grandmaster), you are looking at about a 36 year loop. Now THAT'S dedication.

As for weapons, remember that Tae Kwon do is translated as "The Way of the Foot and the Fist". Traditional martial arts weapons are NOT required learning, although many good instructors can and do teach some weapons techniques. And there is no rule that says you cannot supplement your Tae Kwon Do training with weapons training. In my opinion, the true definition of a Mixed Martial Artist is one who has trained in different styles, and has reached a level of competency in each that he can instruct in each one.