Mike Tyson's Downfall?

Question

First of all, I am a big Mike Tyson fan regardless on what others have to say about his attitude, behavior, or negativities. My major question is why isn't he regarded as one of the best ever? I heard he is now bankrupt...is that also true? If it wasn't for all the criticism he received during the height of his career...would he be considered a legend?

I know Mike Tyson was a pretty crazy thugged out individual but what made him do what he did to be criticized from commentators alike

Answer 1

It was once said of Tyson that he could have went 100 fights undefeated. I tend to believe this to be true.

The early Tyson would come at an opponent bobbing and weaving and jabbing before landing lightning fast crushing uppercut and powerful hooks with either hand.

Tyson may still have lost to Holyfield, but I can defiantly see the potential to go undefeated.

Tyson’s down fall began when Cus Damato who was like a father to Tyson died. Tyson never really got along to well with trainer Kevin Rooney although it’s Rooney who made Tyson what he was.

Then Tyson met Robin Givens who in turn introduced Tyson to her friend Don King. Together they lured Tyson away from manager/promoter and friend of the D’Amato family Bill Clayton.

Don King showed Tyson the money and life he could have if he went with Don King. (Remember Tommy Gunn in Rocky V, the part where he is lured away from Rocky is a rip off of what happened to Mike Tyson)

After King got control of Tyson he convinced Tyson to fire Kevin Rooney and hire new trainers that had allegiances to King.

With Rooney gone Tyson no longer had the 1,2,3 A2,A3,B2 training sequence that made him unstoppable. While watching a Tyson fight you can hear Rooney shouting out Numbers  A3!! HE would shout and Tyson immediately would throw the corresponding punch. If Rooney seen a guys right hand was low he would yell out a number combination and Tyson would throw it on instinct because he knew the call so well.

Without Rooney Tyson became a one punch wonder and over time his head movement and his jab started to fade away. Then by the time he fought Douglas his Jab and combo's had faded and he was picked apart by a guy who just 7 years earlier couldn’t have carried Tyson’s Jock strap.

Myself I still list Tyson in the top 10 heavyweights of all time, when Tyson was great he was the most dominating force the heavyweight division had seen or has yet to see. Along with being the youngest heavyweight of all time he was the biggest PPV draw for over 15 years and carried the sport on his shoulders. So is he a top 10? absolutely.

So what ruined Tyson? Well Robin Givens broke him mentally, Don King showed him the Hollywood lifestyle, and his new loan shark trainers helped to slowly deteriorate his skills. Don't forget the lying ***** that sent him to prison (possibly with Kings help) And most of all Mike Tyson himself  for being greedy and dumb enough to fall for it.

Yes Tyson is bankrupt and still owes money to the IRS (mostly Kings fault) but he still has more money then any regular person.

Also Tyson when he was with Rooney and D'Amato was never this in your face thug maniac he became later in his career, thats largly Kings doing to sell PPV's. When he was with DAmato he was polite and respectful of his opponents.

So why is Tyson not in the top 5 of all time? because he was too stupid to handle the stardom, and he didnt have anyone there to tell him NO or steer him on the right path.

In Kings mind anything Tyson did inside or outside the ring just helped to boost the imageDon King wanted people too see.

Leeches

Answer 2

Mike Tyson's downfall came the moment he stepped in the ring with top notch, tough fighters - period.

Answer 3

You look at a fighters whole career. I'd put him at number 20 all time.  Definitely one of the better punchers obviously

Heart and ring mentality were his downfall.  When he got hurt he didn't know what to do.  He just kept coming forward and had no strategy except to land a bomb.

Answer 4

He will always be one of the best in my opinion,  but I think he started believing all that was said about him and thought he could just show up to a fight throw a couple punches, knock the guy and leave.  He stopped training like he use to, he did not jab as much and his head movement was not the same in  his last fights.  He lost his focus

Answer 5

I cannot top Ruddigers great answer if I wrote it myself word for word,a great answer from Galactacus as well which Ive just read.

Answer 6

Galactus and Ruddiger have it straight.

I will add three more items.

One, steroids. Tyson was juiced, and he started young. It catches up with people.

Two, conditioning. Mike followed a brutal training regime. After Rooney was fired, Tyson stopped training hard, and got out of shape.

Three, desire. Boxing takes a lot of dedication. Once someone wins the championship so young, there is no place to go but down. Ali had the mentality to come back after losing. Tyson did not.

Still, Tyson ranks in the top twenty of all time. Great jab, speed, chin, and power shots.

Answer 7

Ruddiger pretty much broke it down for you, I can't add anymore to that.

Answer 8

i believe he is a legend, just before the masters started they were comparing Tiger Woods' current dominance to that of Mike Tysons at his peak, where people just came to see him dominate and didn't even really care about the competition, now that is a good compliment

Answer 9

History is going to be very good to Mike Tyson because there was never a boxer before him or after him in the heavy weight div that fought with that much ferocity as a former boxer my self .When Mike fought for me it was like going to school you were seeing something that you should be able to learn to do but could not . When Cus died Mike,s trainer that was it the only person Mike wanted to prove anything to was Cus and with out that motivation Mike was finished as a great fighter. I,ve got one question for anyone who does not think Mike Tyson was a great fighter? Who would you rather fight Muhammad Ali or Mike Tyson when both fighters were 21 years old.With Ali you had a chance with Tyson you had no chance.Tyson brought fear to the fight game not many boxers have had that element in there game. Just think if Cus would have lived 10 years longer Tyson would have gone down as the greatest heavy weight fighter of all time.

Answer 10

Why isn't Tyson regarded as one of the best ever?  Good question.  Here are some answers.  

He lost to the best fighters he ever faced and some frindge contenders along the later part of his career.  You don't count Tyson-McBride any more than you count Ali-Holmes.  It helps to examine each loss and determine if each could have been reversed either via rematch or at another point in his career.  

First let's look at the tools he brings to the table and determine where he might fit in.   HE's Bigger, stronger and punches harder and faster than Joe Frazier.  He has Floyd Patterson's speed and his chin is one of the best ever.  

Some might dispute this but I dare say he has a tougher chin than both Frazier and Marciano.   This doesn't say how he fares against either.  We're only talking chins here.  Frazier was rocked with one shot many times in his career.  To mind comes his near stoppages against Ali (second fight)  and Bonavena (Frazier was VERY lucky).  Rocky was dropped by Moore and Walcott, both single shots.  

Tyson has never been dropped with a single shot early in a fight.  He has been KO'd but all were a result of round after round of pounding.  Plus you must consider the men he faced.   Let's be honest,  Can you find ANYONE besides Forman and Shavers who can hit like Razor Ruddock?  Lennox Lewis belongs in that class but few others.  

Given all his tools Tyson should be a hand full for anyone.  None before him, of his type, ever faced men as BIG as his opponents.  Tyson's greatest weakness is his fragile mind and poor balance and stamina.  

Rocky at 188 can not beat Tyson at 216.   Its just not realistic, given the styles to think he would.   However, if they fought at the same time the training would be different and Rocky would be around 200-202.  Its just realistic and That Rocky would win.  At 188 he's just simply too small.  I know he beat a few 200+ but none come close to Tyson.

Many think Tyson began to decline when Cus died.  That's not totally true.    It was Jim Jacobs who guided Mike.   Cus gave him his start and began training him but it was Jacobs who molded him for adult life and the public.  Cus deserves a LOT of credit.   He gave Mike more than he will ever be able to appreciate.  

Cus could not prepare Mike for the real world.   That was Jacobs' job.  and NO ONE did it better.  I've met Jacobs a few times.   He was an amazing man when it came to understand humans of different avenues.   He could have a conversation with a wino and a Wall Street exec at the same time.   I know because I've witnessed it.  

Even Don King couldn't touch Mike with Jim around.  People with words can be very powerful.  Don is proof of that.  He conned the pres. of Zaire to front the money to stage Ali-Forman and stole the fight right from under Arum's nose.  WITH WORDS!!!!!    But Don was NO MATCH for Jacobs and he Knew it.  He stayed clear and got his lucky break after Jacob's unfortunate, untimely death at age 51.    

That's when the vultures settled in.   Cayton, a good man in his own right, was no match for Don King.   While Mike could relate to Jacobs he was just too distant from Cayton.  Cayton is a white business man in his 70s.  He has NOTHING with a young black man in his early 20s..................from the hood.   It wasnt personal on either side.  

They just couldn't relate.   This made it easy for Don to step in, bring his hoodlums and force Cayton, Rooney and anyone else who didnt get with the program, OUT.   Then Robin and her mother flocked in.  It was disgusting because, for all his power,  MIke really didn't have a mind of his own.  

It remains one of the saddest things to ever happen to Hvyt boxing.   Don clouded Mike's mind with all that phony "Mah brotha" c**p and from that point Mike just nodded and did as he was told.  He was then transformed from a reformed, humble, appreciative champion to a foul-mouthed ungreatful jerk.  I could go all night but that's where the downfall begins.  Like Cus often told Mike,  "It's all in your character".

In time Mike will get his just due but he will not be ranked as high as he could have been.   He will always suffer from a little dose of "Max Bare Syndrome",  a fighter who could have done so much more.          

With Cus and Rooney Mike loses only to Ali, Holmes, Louis Forman and Holyfield.  This doesnt make them 1 thru 6.  Its all in styles.  He beats the rest.  

With anyone else he loses to the above five and to Marciano, Frazier, Lewis.  He still beats the rest.

Answer 11

He is one of the greatest,  just like Ali he was stripped of 3 prime years of his career for the rape charges.   Someone said he couldn't beat any good fighters he beat everyone in front of him & not only beat them destroyed them.   Everyone talks about Rocky being so great & he beat a ton of stiffs & sometimes not even that impressive.   Young Mike Tyson with Kevin Rooney as his trainer would have beat Joe Frazier, Larry Holmes, Ken Norton, Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson, Rocky Marciano, & probably other greats I didn't name.   He was powerfull, strong , great chin & technically sound when he was in his early 20's.   I don't know if he's broke & someone said it best he had a ton of leches on him who didn't care about him just about money.   Its too bad he could have been one of the greatest of all time if Cus didn't pass way!!!!

Answer 12

good fighter with the wrong people = disaster

Answer 13

generally, mike is usually in people's top twenties for best heavyweight ever, morally, people place him so low on the list because he didnt act like the "peoples" heavyweight champion (i.e. talk softly during interviews, have his face turn red when a girl is mentioned, photos of him wiping oil off a seal, things like that) and some people place him low on the list because he didnt face very tough opponents during his title reign, but people forget from 1986-1990, there was no good opponents available, holyfield, ray mercer, lennox lewis, tommy morrison, riddick bowe, and david tua didnt show until 1991 and on. Whether people like it or not mike is a legend and always will be, just ask any first grader who has no idea what boxing is and they can tell you all about mike tyson. as for his financial situation, its not great but a celebrity like mike dosent have to worry to much, theres plenty of complimentary casino steaks and people will to pay alot of money for his autograph

Answer 14

His downfall was lack of discipline, he did crazy things inside/outside the ring which cost him alot. If he would have had more discipline he could have stayed on top at least 3-4 yrs more