Serious Q for once...hold onto your seats?

Question

I just found out my mare is a hermaphrodite...they did a biopsy of her enlarged teats and found that she had testicles inside of them (i kid you not) and she also has male organs where some of her womanly parts should be and has massive canines. would this contribute to her messed up behaviour and extreme case of herdboundness

Answer 1

someone had a question on the same thing with there horse sometime ago thats when i first heard of it .and i guess it could have something to do with the behaviour.

Answer 2

WoW!!! That crazy! I'm sorry!!

Answer 3

She said it was a serious question...so I am refraining from *cough* commenting!

It's a wonder the horse is even remotely sane with conflicting hormones.  I don't know if one 's*x' produces more hormones than the other or not.  Or do they just compete daily??

I personally would think about contacting a vet school.  They have got to be interested in something like this.  I'm not looking at this from a money making point of view...but just so students and teachers alike could see this.  For education purposes....*I'm not opposed to money though...if they were offering*

Answer 4

Wow, what were the chances of that!  I'm sure that the combination of both male and female hormones would definitely create some strange behaviors.  I would suggest having her "gelded" so you don't have to worry about the testosterone issues.  You might also want to contact a vet school in your area and let them know your situation.  They may be interested in using her for a "study" and might do the procedure free, or at a big discount.  How often to vet students get to see a hermaphrodite horse?

Answer 5

That's got to be contributing towards it.

My friend found out that her horse had male hormones - no idea if she had the bits as well - they sent her back to her owner because she was batty.

I'd just go by what the vet says - he's got to have more information available to him than anyone else.

Personally I'd seriously consider getting her neutered or gelded at least - the conflicting hormones must be horrendous.

Answer 6

Did your vet say that this problem could be managed with medication?   You said that an operation isn't an option at her age.

This is the first time I've heard of this happening to a mare but wouldn't surprise me.

Answer 7

it sounds like that could be the case!... wow! i honestly have never heard of that!!... however i would suggest that you ask your vet just to be sure!... maybe you could have her "gelded" to fix the problem!... if that is possible??

GOOD LUCK

Answer 8

boy you weren't kidding when you said hold on to your seats! I never heard of it in a horse...but if humans and dogs can have it happen....why not horses?

If you aren't using her for anything...maybe just get rid of the testies if possible since they are in her teats...shouldn't be any different then gelding a colt...hmmm Wonder if she has the milk plumbing along with the testies in the teats?

Can't wait to hear what else your vet says about this if he looks into it further.

Answer 9

Yes, it would contribute the her/his behavior. At the same time I think animals are only as weird in their behavior as their owners. HA!

But really that is pretty rare. I have not come across that myself, but my folks have come across one, in their 40 years of training/raising horses. Getting both male and female hormones will contribute, but mostly what ever the ''primary'' s*x of a hermaphrodite will be the dominate hormones.

Edit- Awe redial, I ment that as a complement.

Answer 10

Is this the mare that is in love with the "stud post" you have talked about?  She is probably very confused!

Can't wait to read BB's answer...

Too bad Lisa M isn't on here much anymore, she has given great advice on subjects like this before.

Sorry I'm not more help, but keep us posted!  Oops was that bad, umm... updated!

Answer 11

i really dont know how to answere this but........wow i didnt know that could happen.......this is like a medical mystery.....*goes out to check mare*

Answer 12

The production of testosterone by the testes diminishes with age, as does the production of estrogens in females, so in an older horse the effects are already diminishing.  The adrenal glands continue to produce both male and female hormones in smaller amounts.  The erratic behavior of the horse is probably related to the hormone fluctuations. Since your horse has testes, he (she) doesn't have a separate set of ovaries.  It probably has ovotestes, which is a combination of ovarian and testicular tissue present in the organs found in the teats and identified as testes.  The impact of surgical removal of these organs would be unpredictable and could be radical.

Answer 13

Yep. That's nuts! Nature sure can be weird. Um, is this really a question? Because dude, your horse is a he-she! Hormones would be all out of wack! So yeah that could have made her act messed up.  DUDE!

Answer 14

well i can't answer the question... but that is very... interesting... hmm..

well have fun with your she/male =D

Answer 15

the hormones from both sexes may

Answer 16

0.0

Odd thing to find.  Did you (or maybe your vet) laugh?

I would see if you can get her "gelded", to get rid of the testosterone, and/or "spayed", to get rid of the estrogen.  It is probably contributing to her behaviour problems, with two different sets of hormones, but it shouldn't be the cause of her(or maybe his?) herd-boundness.  Either way, you can work through it with time and effort.  I know people who train stallions and get them as broke, quiet, and predictable by age 4 as any 20 year old gelding would be.

You can fix the herdboundness (for lack of a better word), by working her hard in the center of the herd, or as close as yo can get her to it.  Work her until she is ready to drop dead, then take her away from the herd and let her rest.  Repeat as many times as nessesary.  

Good luck!

Answer 17

Short answer...In a heartbeat!  I would suggest removing the testicles and if she has ovaries as well (rare but it happens) have them removed via the vaginal opening.  In other words have her spayed in the non invasive method.  They go in through the vaginal opening up teh fallopian tube with a little wire sprial and twist out the ovaries.  Simple with few complications.

She is sterile most likely anyway so you are not losing anything there.  And the spay job will make sure she does not come in heat and produces a calmer horse.  

But yes part of the reason for herdboundness is probably her heightened harmone level.  The other part is learned however, so by removing both sets of harmone producing organs you should have amare that will settle into a very fine riding animal.

BTW

Most people who have tried spayed mares, prefer them to geldings.

And neither surgery is invasive.  but if you do not want to do that then retraining will help immensely.

One more thing the harmones are the same ones just in different amounts.  Males have a higher testosterone level than females while females tend to have a higher estrogen content.  This horse probably has higher level of both because she has two sets of organs producing them.

Answer 18

According to my bff, Dr. K., it's not as uncommon as you might think.

He's seen a few in his years of practice (CA, TX & Fl) and teaching  (Tx.A&M, Auburn).  A mare of this age and just being identified is probably rare.

Answer 19

wow- a stallion and mare in one... that might be quite the ultimate job! lol. anyways, s/he probably is so severe because of all those hormones and stuff that make her/ him super excited. or, s/he is just really attached to her buds. good luck...

oh yeah, maybe you should get her/ him gelded- either the male or female way or both ways to help her not get as excited!

Answer 20

WOW! 0.o that is truly amazing ! I guess that would totally make her beahvior screwed up... but wow lol I seriously am in Awe shes like a stallion... but I would say it is totally why she/he is heard bound, she/he prob is doing what stallions do with the heards and the mares of the heard and being a freak about there heard.  

Keep us updated! this is so interesting!

Answer 21

Sounds like you got a cross dressing horse on your hands. Maybe you should enter her in a drag queen competition. Hey maybe you can double register her as a mare and as a gelding. Ha sorry I had to be a smart *** since thats all you've been the last couple of days. You can't deny it