Should train drivers earn the same as airline pilots, given their responsibility?

Question

train drivers in fact often have more lives in their care than the average airline pilot, yet are paid a fraction. Something amiss there?

Answer 1

Overall, these are the funniest answers I've ever seen in the good ol' rail category.

I especially like the one about operating in "one dimension".  That's rich...

paul p has 10 points due him.

Thanks for the laugh.

Answer 2

I think they should, they have a very difficult job with hundreds of lives in their care every journey they make. With the state of our rail network at the moment i think they are doing an outstanding job!

Answer 3

No, people aren't (or shouldn't) be paid for responsibility - they are paid for their skill.

If someone is going to be irresponsbile unless they think they are paid enough, then I would never trust them to take care of me! I'll walk...

Answer 4

What?

Its not even that train drivers have to think where they're going lol

Apparently, they get more than ME (and I've got a degree...)

When I told my boss this at my appraisal, he said go and be a train driver then!

Not quite the response I had in mind...lol

Answer 5

Flying a plane is a thousand times more difficult than driving a locomotive. There is usually no "do over" if you make a mistake. Statistically,  airline pilots usually die and railway personnel usually survive.

Either way, they are both the first ones at the scene of an accident!  ;^)

Answer 6

As a train driver, I feel that airline pilots should be paid more than us. But some of the answers on here already are an absolute joke. Anyone who thinks driving a train is easy is not living in the real world. Admittedly, physically moving a train from A to B isn't hard but all the stuff that goes with it, particularly stock and route knowledge is where the money is earned.

I'm forever getting stick about the money I earn but my reply is this: If it's so easy and overpaid then why aren't you all doing it? (Take note, London's Evening Standard).

Another accusation is that train drivers are paid too much in relation to professions such as nursing. Could it not be that nurses are vastly underpaid as opposed to train drivers being overpaid?

Answer 7

Quite a lot of them already do.

Answer 8

Train driver? They are called locomotive engineers. They are called engineers rather than drivers because of what goes into moving a train from point A to point B. When you have a train 10,000 feet long (not a typo) that weighs over 15,000 tons (also not a typo) and each car can have about 3-4 feet of slack moving in and out while you are moving you better be doing something other than just along for the ride. When more than 50% of the trains weight crests a hill it will drag the remainder of the train on over and when that much weight runs in and slaps you in the backside you will take off like a rocket and cause you to have a runaway train or derail unless that guy just sitting there "driving" knows when to start applying the brakes ahead of time.

If a fully loaded airliner crashed into downtown Atlanta thousands of people could be killed, if a freight train loaded with chlorine gas or LP gas or many other nasty chemicals crashed in downtown Atlanta tens of thousands of people could be killed.

There are many more safety measures in place reguarding safety measures for airlines compared to the railroads.

Looking at the potential catastrophy I would say they should be paid the same.

Answer 9

to those of you who say no.....   When you are driving your car, you are not crossing in front of an airplane.  The engineer has to know where all his crossings are, not only the ones ahead of him, but the ones he is still blocking.  Also, alot of engineers are hauling not only people but hazardous materials as well.  They have ALOT of responsibilty and are definately underpaid.

Answer 10

I think it's because train drivers and airline pilots get paid for what they know more than what they do. There are more possible disaster scenarios with an airplane than a train and the knowledge more complex. Added to that, most airline accidents result in death of the entire occupants of an airplane, but train accidents do not result in such massive loss of life.

Bus drivers get just above minimum wage by the way!

Answer 11

I think they should yes. But turn the question round. Should signallers earn the same as air traffic controllers?

This is my job (a signaller) I am responsible for up to 10 trains or more at a time. Each one of these could be carrying over 100 passengers.

Yet drivers of these trains are on £34k and i'm on £25,571.

Wheres the justification??

Answer 12

Train drivers have a lot more responsibility because at any one time you can have upto 1000 passengers travelling on your train.

You always have to be alert for any sorft of occurance from signalling problems to passenger emergency alarms being activated to tresspassers on the track.

Also you HAVE to know your train, if you get a problem you are expected to be able to isolate around that fault to get your train moving atleast to the next station, detrain then go out of service.

Answer 13

Like people have said before, Airline pilots have to spend decades training to fly. Drivers take a couple of years.

There is more chance of a rail accident than an air one..there are about the same number of people...more can go wrong with aircraft but trains are more reliable.

The autopilot does most of the work on flights..drivers have to do all of it. Driving a train is hard (i know), but driving a plane is harder..then again, you're only flying in a straight line with most flights...The only hard bit is landing/taking off.

Answer 14

Not an easy question, as both jobs involve different skills.  It's a case of getting paid not for what you do, but what you might have to do.

I would suggest that train drivers have to maintain a higher level of concentration.  Drive a train at 100 MPH  in thick fog or falling snow, and you'll know what I mean.

Train drivers also have to face additional hazards, such as people committing suicide in front of you, and mindless vandals placing objects on the line or throwing things at you (putting your life and those of your passengers at risk).

Rather than comparing my wages to other professions, I prefer to just look at what I get.  On balance, I think I get a fair rate of pay.

Answer 15

As soon as they put planes on rails we can drop their outrageous salaries.

Answer 16

Airline pilots have to deal with jetlag, working very anti social hours and separation from their families.(Train drivers do too but I think pilots do more) It might sound trivial but I think they should be paid extra for this reason.

Answer 17

Some of these answers: 'if you can drive a car, then you can drive a Train''  what a load of cobblers!, driving a train is 100x harder than driving a car.

two years minimum training, extensive route knowledge, traction fault repairs,1000 people on board in the rushhour, poor railhead season coming up..vandalism and yobs to contend with, signals in waterloo area which are the most dangerous in the country.....

train drivers, should be paid minimum £50k a year...

AND people, the article in the news of the world the other sunday was all lies, no driver would sleep like it said, its  impossible,as the safety systems are there to prevent things like that happen, ive been a  driver for 16 years and its never happened..  just press scaremongering again!!

Answer 18

Some of the answers have made me smile. As a train driver I can honestly say it's the most responsible job I have had.

In relation to pilots I don't think we should be on as much as  a 747 captain for example, but we should be on a bit more than we are considering our responsibilty.

For example tonight I was braking for a station and the train started to slide due to poor railhead conditions; it was misty. Due to my route knowledge and experience I had anticipated this and ensured that I braked earlier so the train stopped safely. This is the sort of thing we do all the time, both passenger and freight drivers. It's not just knowing rules and knowing a route, it's applying your knowledge so that you can drive your train safely. Were not just sitting there watching the world go by, every second of our job requires vigilance and concentration for who know's what's round the next corner?

What also matters is how both pilots and train drivers respond in an emergency, not just the day to day running of the job.  As everyone is saying, there is autopilot, and trains aren't steered etc., but what happens when things go wrong?

That's what we are paid for, that's how we pass the aptitude tests and interviews. We are both trained to respond to emergency situations such as fire etc and deal with it in safety. We also have realistic simulators which can test a train driver's knowledge and application of the rules in an emergency.  We are regularly downloaded to monitor our driving technique and sent for annual rules tests to ensure we are up to scratch, much as pilots are tested in simulators.

So there are a lot of parallels with the two jobs. What matters to you as a passenger is that when you are going along at 100mph in the fog, that there is a professional at the front who knows what he/she is doing and as such should be paid accordingly.

In response to the one that said that he had a degree and was surprised to be on less than a train driver, that's a bit pretentious. Having a degree doesn't make you better than everyone else.

Answer 19

and ptlots need more training

Answer 20

I work on the railway and can tell you there is more to driving a train DAY IN DAY OUT than meets the eye.  Sure just to get it moving is easy but knowing your route, memorising every signal, alarm, crossing, points, and station cant be that easy.  Then there is the stress.  Imagine flying down the line at 125 with workers stood just 6'6" from your train.   "Did they all live?" etc etc.   It requires more concentration than flying a plane as you never have any oppertunity to look away and relax unlike flying a plane for even just 1 hr.  Auto pilot is a good thing for those guys.

Answer 21

First of all, you can be a train driver with a few years of training.  It takes DECADES to become a highly paid airline pilot.  Many years of doing crappy jobs to try and build hours to become a first officer that makes between 30-50K per year.

Driving a train is one of the easiest jobs in the world (I drove a diesel once).  You don't have to navigate (or steer), you don't have to deal with the weather, and you are going a lot slower.

Answer 22

i dont think so ,that would mean bus drivers would deserve the same pay as airline pilots too

Answer 23

no............. airline pilots have a more risky job

Answer 24

Flying a plane is easier then driving a train. For example all a pilot needs to do is understand navigation equpment, different types of aircraft and flightplans.

A train driver however is paid for knowledge. To be a train driver you have know the route inside out, the traction you will be driving, understanding how signals work, safety procedures, every line speed you will be travelling over, rules & regulations, junction turnouts, dealing with weather conditions, have to take random drug and alcohol tests. My mate is a train driver on Virgin Trains.

Answer 25

They make good money for what they do.

Answer 26

these days most planes fly on auto pilot.most of the way.

do trains do it no.so train drivers should get the same money.

Answer 27

Fantastic question, as for the answers so far, give or take a few, i've never read so much c**p in my life.

Train Driving is a science, not an occupation. The amount of knowledge and skill required to drive a train in the UK today is un-beliveable. That's probably why so many answers to this qusetion are so far off the mark.

To carry out my job i've had to......

Pass various medical tests

Pass various Psychometric tests

Carry out training in rules and regulations of Train working (on which I get tested every 2 years. just an example of this is that the Network Rail Rule Book for Train Drivers is about 6-8 inches thick, we have to know it from cover to cover!)

Be trained to drive several different types of train, and know exactly how they opperate, how to prepare them for use and how to dispose (stable) them properly afterwards.

You have to learn and experience different train handing techniques. Small passenger trains react alot differently to 1900tonne Stone Trains!!!!!!!!

Learn and have an exacting knowledge of all railway lines that we/I am/are required to drive Trains over (Speed's, Gradients, Geographical location, areas of Low Adhesion, Location of EVERY SIGNAL over 1000's of miles, local working instructions.....I could go on, but as an example, an average Driver would take around 15 - 20 weeks to learn the road from Crewe to Euston.

Also, as someone else has taken into account, the unsociable hours.....and yes we do spend time away from home when we are on long job's (known as "Lodging Turns", I was away from home 3 nights last week for example)

I am fully aware that as a Train Driver I do earn more money than some pilots that work for some of the smaller airlines or freight companies, and on the whole the money is good, but compared with the responsibility, the fact that there is no "Auto Pilot", of "Navigation System", and the only radar or guidance we have during bad weather (thick fog, heavy rain, snow fall etc....) is the good old Mk1 eyeball, then yes, I think we do deserve an equal pay structure.

Answer 28

Quite agree about the complexity of the job - saw a programme on the telly about it a while back, tread on this pedal, control the speed using a joystick, look out for signals etc.

Not exactly rocket science is it.

Anyone with the ability to learn to drive a car can do the same with a train.

Thing is, when it breaks down it usually coasts to a halt, rail accidents don't usually originate from the driver but from things he/she has no control over - track condition, failure to maintain or cattle on the track.

A pilot on the other hand may have to land a crippled aircraft or deal with in flight problems hopefully without you being aware of them.

And if you have ever been on an aircraft that had to land with one leg up you realise he's worth every penny of that salary.

Answer 29

Railway drivers don't even deserve what they get now....they just drive trains..that's not difficult!...

learn to start and stop at signals and stations...eerrrr!

If you can drive a car you can drive a train.

Who should really get paid the most.....Signallers.

We're the one who has to take the decisions when to stop a train and why.

We're the people who have to protect staff working on the line.

We do far more than any driver....get paid less and have to know more rules and regulations and get tested every 13 weeks on them too.

We're the first to be blamed and the first point of contact when something go'es wrong yet earn a fraction of what a driver do'es.

The lowest grade signaller with a family can even qualify for state benefits!

Answer 30

good point but i drought it would be recognised

Answer 31

No, I do not agree.  And I was a train driver before I became a police officer.

It is a repsonsible job, but train drivers only have to worry about one dimension, in which you can only go forward and backwards.  Road drivers, whatever they drive, have to worry about two dimensions, because they have to steer.  Pilots have to worry about going up or down as well.