The Electric Car Road Trip Problem - do you have a solution?

Question

They have entirely electric cars available for commercial purchase right now. Here's a high end one: http://www.teslamotors.com/ that looks pretty darn nice (though admittedly its $109k w a 15 month wait)

The main problem I have with entirely electric cars is that when you run out of "fuel" it takes approx 3 hours to fully recharge. Gasoline cars, of course, take 5 minutes or less. So if we moved to all electric cars, no one would really be able to road trip it anymore - which to me is a serious loss of freedom.

Can you think of any solutions to this problem, technical or otherwise?

How can we have entirely-electric powered cars without giving up the ability to go on long distance road trips?

please dont bother answering if your answer is "you cant" or "it'll just take longer"

please DO answer if you have an idea. Thanks!

Answer 1

Your initial statement is flawed.  While Tesla Motors will be delighted to accept your payment now, a great deal can happen over the next fifteen months, and it'll be interesting to see what sort of car they actually deliver in the fall of 2010.  

Note that the rate of energy transfer is the same as power, and if you examine the amount of energy necessary to run your electric car for, say, five hours, you'll see why it takes a long time to charge it.  Fifty horsepower for five hours = 50 hp for 300 minutes.  To transfer that much energy in the five minutes you specify means that we must divide the time by 12 and multiply the horsepower by 12, which comes out 3600 hp.  Now, in terms of watts, that's 746 w/hp x 3600 hp = 2.68 megawatts.  

Oh, dandy.  That'll be really easy to implement in that 'high-voltage recharge station.'  Were you planning to run, say, ten amperes through the cable at 268,000 volts, perhaps?  That sounds handy.  How about 1000 amperes at 27 kilovolts?  The switches will really like that: you'll have an arc following your Tesla all the way out of the 'charging station.'

There's an appalling lack of basic engineering knowledge right now, and the current debate over hypothetical electric cars is perhaps the best illustration.  

The best solution?  Electric Greyhound inter-city buses run by overhead wires.  It's an old technology, and a good one.  Bring a lunch, and a keg of beer, and let them do the driving.

Answer 2

The beauty of alternators in the cars we are used to (gasoline powered) is that they charge the battery as the gas keeps the vehicle and the alternator on. So the double battery suggestion is a viable option. One running the vehicle while the other charges off its kinetic energy.  Also, for emergency purposes, a rudimentary, somewhat primitive means of "recharging" the vehicle can be implemented (such as a wind-up energy boost for the engine, used in early Fords)

Answer 3

This “problem” was solved many years ago. It was proposed that all batteries be a standard size, size as in dimensions, and standard connectors. You would pull up to a service station. You would open a door on the side of the car slid one battery pack out and slide a fully charged pack in pay for the service and go on your way. In tests it took less then 3 minuets.

Answer 4

Are you able to carry precharged batteries even if they are only low capacity, They could possibly be sold at filling stations, but honestly if we all go the electric route i would hope filling stations would be dotted about the place and reserve batteries made regularly avialable. I suppose the other option is go for a lighter vehicle so it's not as tiring to push :)

Answer 5

solar panels, two sets of batteries, one charging from the movement of the car while the other set is powering it.

Answer 6

Trolley cars use an overhead electric wire.

Look maw, no batteries.

Answer 7

2 solutions come to mind for me. a trailer with solar panels on it

or

a nice lightweight high efeciancy generator.

I would also fully expect that if we went electric as a country that we would indeed have electric filling stations. It wouldbe very easy to do in fact and would require far less maintenance then conventional gas stations. All that would be needed is a amp meter and some good contacts. Makeing a station to charge a car in 5 minutes would be possable and very feasable. What would be really cool would be stations that use solar power and give discounted rates to help encourage people to go green!

Answer 8

Electric cars for commuting to/from work would be a great idea.  This is where most people consume gas.

Gas cars could then be used for long distance or high loads.

Answer 9

There are many ways to approach this problem. The T-Zero used to do it by towing a genset trailer ( An earlier A.C. propulsions vehicle that shares similar drive systems with the Tesla). Pictured on this link.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genset_trai...

Other vehicle systems get around the problem by using pantograghs to draw energy directly from mains power. (either overhead or beside the road. Quite similar to systems used by trolley cars and electric trains etc.

My favorite and probably the simplest. Is to just change the battery. Even at 450 kg (for teslas battery) few doubt that with the right design a discharged battery could be replaced for a fully charged one in a matter of minutes. This would be as easy to manage as a bar-b-que gas swap and go station.

Ten minute rapid recharge is more than a bit doubtful, especially with lithium ion batteries.  Above a maximum charge voltage Lithium ion becomes unstable and you risk them catching fire or blowing up. The maximum charge rate for most lithium ion batteries is limited to 80% capacity. Above this level the charge rate must be reduced to avoid damage from high voltage.Rapid recharge creates lots of waste heat that significantly shorten battery life (those batteries are not cheap)

The Telsa battery  stores about 53 Kilowatts hours of energy.http://www.teslamotors.com/display_data/...

When you realise that this is more energy than most homes consume in three days, you can start to appreciate the problems that trying to deliver it in ten minutes will bring. Add to this that the rapid recharge station would probably need to charge several vehicles at once.

Another solution would be to keep your fossil burner for road trips only and use the electric for everything else. If your like most people this will reduce petrolium dependance by over 90%.

Then there is the humble bicycle. A road trip on a bicycle is a challenging and rewarding experience.

Answer 10

I hate to say it, but at the moment there's no replacement for the gasoline engine.

The fuel is easy and safe to store and transfer.  Also it's everywhere and would be reasonably cheap if we were allowed to drill for the 400+ billion barrels we have available in the US.

Sadly, any new alternative fuel will take decades to be readily available and will be very expensive for years.

I'll get a lot of thumbs down for this, but I don't see why we can't continue to use oil until we get an alternative in place and it's proven itself.  

Also, don't forget, we could never get away from oil completely since it's used in just about everything we make from plastics to rubber and everything in between.

Answer 11

Simple - high voltage rapid recharge stations.  Electric cars have the option of a 10 minute recharge at these sorts of stations.  They cost several thousand dollars to install, but if gas stations would install a few, the problem would be solved.  I suspect this will happen once electric cars become more popular.

http://www.autoneato.com/phoenix-electri...

Another option is to make the battery removable so you can swap it out for a fully charged one when it's low.  Then you just have battery recharge stations which have charged up batteries ready to go, and recharge your depleted battery.

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2008/04/...