The final card scene in Rounders...?

Question

the final game with KGB, in the last hand Mike has 8 9 of spades and flops the nuts 6 7 10, what two cards do you think Teddy KGB was holding?

Answer 1

I thought about that a bit.  I remember he said "the ace could not have helped you."  Which lead me to believe:

A.  He had pocket aces (in which case the best hand his opponent could have had was trip Ts (neglecting the straight); even if his opponent had an ace, the best hand he could have had was aces up assuming KGB had pocket rockets).

B. He had aces up (AT, most likely).

C.  He had top set on the flop (trip tens) and was assuming Mike couldn't have had pocket aces from the way he was playing.

Judging by how upset he was when Mike showed his nut hand, I'm going to assume it was A or C, more likely C.  Think about it.  He went all in on the river.  If he had a set of aces, wouldn't he want a call?  Why not make a smaller bet for value?  I think he had trip tens, hoping Mike caught something (like two pair or top pair on the river) and assumed he would get paid off (if Mike had a hand like A9 suited).

Just my opinion though.

Answer 2

I've heard if you watch the DVD in slow motion you can see pocket 10's when he "mucks" his cards.

*To the poster below, in theory you make sense...but the two hands were likely more than an hour or two apart.  He let KGB know about seeing his tell before he gets his initial money back, then sits again and KGB reloads for $20K...at some point KGB reloads another $20K because Mike leaves with $60K.  Mike's move to put KGB on tilt does work, but there's no way to say KGB was bluffing $40K later.  Also, you don't react like KGB did when you get called on a bluff by someone who is holding the nuts...you react like that when they call all in  with a pair or something.  His reaction is more likely that of someone who thought they had the hand won the whole time.

Answer 3

Why would Mike give away KGB's tell?  The mad Russian was a tilter.  Mike didn't have all night to wait until he had a good setup against him.  So, he tilted him so that KGB would induce a bluff.

He says the river couldn't help him, because he is talking him out of the hand. He doesn't want a call, because he is holding junk.

Answer 4

This is a great question. I think Teddy HAD to have a weak hand.  If he flopped a set he would put in a value bet.  Two pair might have been a feeler bet.  My instinct is that he was riding A8 or A9 pretty hard, and felt like he hit the jackpot on the river.

Answer 5

It didn't really matter what KGB had.  He believed that Mike was on a draw.  If he was drawing to a straight like he led KGB to believe, the Ace of course would not have helped him because it doesn't make a straight with the other cards.  Teddy was trying to bet Mike off the hand.  He could have had a lot of possible hands, really.  But the fact that he says "that ace could not have helped you" is not indicative of KGB having an ace, it is about Mike being on a draw.  The key was he didn't feel that Mike would call on the river.  

What I always found funny was how KGB was trying to rub in to Mike how his "fate" was sitting next to him, but actually Mike had more chips that KGB did in that last hand, because he cleaned him out when he won.  KGB had to have re-bought for 20K since Mike left with 60, meaning Mike had over 30K before the hand started and therefore was in no danger if he had folded the hand on the river.