To completely defeat card-counting in Blacjack, why don't casinos just shuffle after each hand?

Question

Firstly, card-counting is very hyped up and absolutely nothing like the get-rich-quick scheme you see in movies. Typically expert counters gain at most a 1 to 1.5% edge over the casino with ridiculous variance (high variance means you can win or lose bundles overnight, you only see a 1% profit over hundreds of hours of play).

But that being said, of course no casino wants to have players gaining any edge over the house. That's why casinos use 6 or 8 mixed decks to make counting cards a lot more difficult.

However, why not just use 2 separate decks and deal poker-style: shuffle one deck with an automatic shuffler while dealing the other? This doesn't make card-counting harder, it makes it impossible, and since one deck's shuffled while the other is in play, this method shouldn't add on significantly to the dealing time.

Certainly if I can think of this, casinos must have thought of this, so what's wrong with this plan?

Answer 1

They have thought of this, their answer is continuous shuffling machines.  Please see link below.

Answer 2

I have worked in the casino gaming industry for 20 years.  

Actually, we have thought of using an automated shuffler with two decks.  We have tried many things, shuffling more frequently, large number of decks, running the deck, paying in the blind.

One thing you overlooked is that most customers do not count cards.  Most customers want to play and have a good time.  They drink, they play, they joke, they don't want to work hard enough to count.  They trust to luck.  Those who do try to count cards do it so poorly that they do not get any advantage; they are fooling themselves.  

Another thing is that slight changes in house rules, including the number of decks, changes the odds.  A six-deck shoe has a natural house advantage of 0.54%, even with liberal rules.  

Since you mentioned statistics, the casino measures alpha, the customers feel sigma.  Even a player with a very large bankroll and lots of free time cannot overcome a day when he has "bad luck."

I, personally, do not like shuffling machines because of the costs involved.  Many casinos install them because they have weak dealers whom they do not trust  to shuffle properly.  Others incorrectly beleive they are worth the time they save.

We are always on the lookout for those who count cards and when we spot them we ask them to leave.  There are tell-tale signs of card counting that cannot be masked.  Although card counting is legal, we can refuse service to anyone without giving a reason.

Answer 3

The vast majority of people cannot count cards, even if say they can.  Then counting isn't enough, you have to know what to do with those numbers.  Having one deck being shuffled while you deal the other isn't time effective for the casino.  Even if one deck is immediately ready, it still must be exchanged and cut which takes too much time throughout the day.

Answer 4

the casinos actually make more money by mking there game beatable the casinos tried making blackjack unbeatable and it backfired drasticallly when people stopped playing it they had to bring back beatable games to insure more profit most card counters lose money through minor mistakes so casinos dont even have to worry about most these card counters to stay in business the casino must run a fair game

Answer 5

Whats wrong is it does add significant time. If I was being generous I could say that it itake at least as long to shuffle as it does to complete 1 round so you are cutting playing time in half at  the least. You are also losing customers due to lack of patience when they want fast action.

Answer 6

Card counters represent such a small portion fo the playing population that if the were weeded out they would be saving money but it would be a very tiny amount of money when compared to the amount of money they lose from shuffling cards after every hand.  Whenever the dealer is shuffling nobody is playing and the casinos lose money.

Also for every proficient card counter there are 20 others that think they can count cards and lose tremendous amounts of money from increasing their bets on a misguided basis, if they shuffled after every hand these ametuer card counters would not play.

While blackjack is the best game in the casino if you know basic strategy, it is also the worst if you do not know how to play it, weeding it out altogether would detroy huge profit margins since the average blackjack player has no idea what they are doing.

Answer 7

The casinos are selling hope.

The punters play blackjack because they believe it is a game that can be beaten (and maybe, if they play carefuly, they migh be the person who beats it).

Shuffle up after every deal would destroy that "hope" and the punters would choose another game.

Answer 8

You are quite right.  An expert card counter these days can get maybe a 1.5% edge over the long term with huge variance in the short term.

This expert must use his skill very subtly because if he is too obvious he may simply be asked not to play any more.  Ultimately he may be banned.  He also has to play perfect strategy, and still hope that when the shoe is in his favor he gets lucky.

I don't think that casinos really need to worry about shuffling between each hand.  The fact is they have subtly changed the rules of the game over the years, so that a card counter really has to shop around for that perfect game.  There are over 3,456 different rule combinations out there.  Some combinations could easily negate that slim player edge.

Frankly, I think the truth is casinos actually like card counters.  They love to create the illusion that the game can be beat.  They probably laughed when 21 came out and everyone started to think that card counting was this great secret to beat the house.

For every player who can gain a consistent 1.5% edge over time, there are probably a hundred players who try and fail, and lose their money.

If casinos were losing money on Blackjack, they would change the rules or stop dealing the game altogether.  But they are not losing.  They are doing just fine.  They don't have to spend $20,000 on a shuffle machine, or have the dealer waste time between hands shuffling the cards, because they are already making a fortune, and they are not scared of counters.

Answer 9

I have played at single deck games where the dealer shuffled after every hand. I have played at double deck games where they only dealt out 2 or 3 hands before shuffling. Everyone who sat at these tables left within 10 hands. Attempting to shuffle after every hand it games with more than one deck would be so time consuming that nobody would bother playing them.

And as someone else said, they already use continuous shuffle machines at many casinos. These machines effectively do what you are proposing.