Toyota's extra Horsepower?

Question

Can anyone show me any documentation that would prove that toyota actually has a HP advantage over the other manufacturers? Please show me links to a legitimate source.... I'm tired of hearing about this in here and a couple of other places, but I've never once seen a link showing any test results.

Answer 1

I dont think thats true ,but Toyota is known for its smooth ride & less maintance

Answer 2

Why is this still an issue. I can't watch the Speed channel for 2 minutes without somebody talking about Toyota's HP advantage from both Waltrips, Rusty Wallace, Chad Knaus, Jimmie Spencer etc. etc.

It's common knowledge now OK. Old news. Believe it.

Answer 3

It's 10-12 horses!! Within the rulebook.  It's always been that way. Ain't nothing no different than its was 40years ago!

Shrub's on a mission and know's how to drive a racecar!

Not a fan, but its true. The dude can drive !!!

Answer 4

Yaaaaaaaaa... what 18 just said... Thanks for the 2 points... and give 18    his due 10 points....  Good answer!!!!

Answer 5

Why would you believe anything in print, such as test results, if you can't even go along with the masses. And besides what are you going to do with the information? The more important issue is for Dodge, Chevrolet, and Ford, to find someone who can axcel their program to supercede Toyota. Sad but true. It's a cold business. Feelings don't win races.

Answer 6

from: http://www.nascar.com/2008/news/headline...

"Does Toyota have a horsepower advantage, as non-Toyota teams have claimed? The last set of dynamometer numbers, taken after Carl Edwards won in a Ford at Milwaukee, would support that assertion. A garage source told Sporting News that Edwards' peak horsepower was measured at 611, compared with 632 for the No. 20 Toyota, 628 for the No. 40 Dodge and 612 for the No. 88 Chevrolet."

so what are we going to do about those d**n dodges? or more appropriately, what kind of fire do we have to light under ford and chevy to prod them to get off their butts and do a better job? if dodge can do it (and they haven't been a force to be reckoned with in a while), one would think that ford and chevy should be able to as well.

the problem isn't the peak horsepower advantage that one toyota has over any other particular car (it only had 4 more peak horsepower than clauson/franchitti's dodge, and no one is complaining about dodge's horsepower advantage). the problem is that jgr and toyota worked within the rules and tuned their engines better, built better bodies, and put the best drivers in their cars, and are now going to be punished for it...

as i've said before, i'm glad nascar doesn't run baseball. every team under the 0.500 mark would be using aluminum bats by now... and next year every team would be issued pre-made, pre-measured, pre-weighed 2x4s, and they'd all be made out of lead.

Answer 7

i'll agree with rowdy  

he's knows what he's talking about

Answer 8

They do have an advantage, just not horsepower. Same motor as last year with 4 very big difference

1. Mark Comquist from JGR building engines.

2. Kyle Busch

3. Tony Stewart

4. Denny Hamlin

Answer 9

If the horsepower issue is true, how come every week the Toyotas do not finish 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, etc.? Thirty horsepower is a tremendous advantage.

It probably seems that way becuase Kyle Busch is so dominant this year. But, did Chevrolet have 30 horsepower last year with Jeffy and Jimmie winning so many races?

After 19 race's:

Toyota 8 wins

Chevy 4 wins

Ford 3 wins

Dodge 4 wins

Looks like parity to me. And when you consider that 7 of Toyota's wins are one car and one driver, somebody's got their stuff together.

NASCAR hasn’t made any concessions to Toyota for this season. The talk of Toyota having 30 or 50 more HP than everyone else is just that talk. Some of the hype is from over zealous sports writers and some of it is from the other manufactures egging them on, trying to get a concession for their camp. Toyota is producing about the same peak HP numbers that they were producing last year. The main reason for the perceived Toyota dominance is the fact that during the off season Toyota did a lot of work engineering wise to understand where they needed to produce good power VS. peak power. It doesn’t really matter how much HP you can produce at 9000 RPM because the engine only stays at 9000 RPM for a shot time near the end of the straight. You would like to produce good HP numbers down in the 6500-7500 RPM range because that is where you spend most of the race which is from the center off in the turn.

If you can produce good HP in that range you will be much faster, than a competitor who might be producing the same end of straight away numbers as you, but lower HP numbers in the 6500-7500 range.

Without getting specific because the teams don’t like that. All the manufactures are running in the range of 770 to 800 HP on the chassis dyno, occasionally someone will be a couple digits over 800. At any given time you can find a spread between the highest to the lowest car of 30 HP, but usually the spread is in the 8 to 15 HP range from best to worst with no single manufacture gaining an edge consistently. The sports writers and other manufactures key on the fact that Toyota might have had the best number, and that number was 30 HP greater than the worst car tested. What they don’t tell you is that the 88 car might have only been 3 HP off the Toyota number. h**l, at times this year the top five cars have all been within 7 HP of each other. Another thing to understand is that NASCAR does not Dyno cars after every race. They average about 10 tests a year unless they have a reason to take the chassis Dyno out more often.

Mark Conquest is the man to blame if you want to point the finger at the guy who came on board to explain Toyota’s issues to them. Toyota came to Cup with a very good plan and a good engineering staff, but to some extent they lacked practical knowledge. Remember prior to their entry into NASCAR Toyota was not in the game of designing high performance cast-iron, pushrod V8s. When JGR switched to Toyota, Mark was one of the first guys that the Toyota engineers called. He is the one who is most responsible for bring practical knowledge to TRD and helping them understand their power band issues. For many it’s hard to believe that one guy could be that important, but he has been. Toyota had all the right parts they just need a little catalyst to put the effort together. Even with Mark onboard Toyota is still not running away with the HP war, all he did was get them to use what they already had in the right place. Hoped that helped a bit, and please don’t believe everything you read.

The #20 car in Nationwide may or may not have an advantage, but I think in Sprint Cup the cars are very similar horsepower wise, and it is something that some people use to discredit the fact that Joe Gibbs is doing so well in Toyota's, namely Kyle Busch.

Dominant teams come and go each year, but this year it seems like Kyle Busch has been able to make the most with what he has. To me it's because he is coming to his own and has better equipment at JGR, instead of Casey Mears cars like last season. I think it is sheer talent. He has more wins alone than any other manufacturer's entire fleet.

Why didn't we hear reports of a "penalty" placed on the Hendricks when they won nearly 50% of the Sprint Cup races last season? The only reason NASCAR is thinking about all of this is the incessant complaining from the Toyota haters, including Jack Roush. NASCAR knows how fans feel about Toyota's involvement, being a foreign manufacturer in a domestic racing series. NASCAR doesn't give a darn about complaints about Hendrick domination or Roush domination, since it wasn't a vocal or loud as the Toyota whining.

Let the teams figure it out. Hendrick got it right last year, Roush got all of his cars in the Chase in '05. It's all a cycle. Eventually Gibbs will go through a down time, and then Roush/Hendrick/Childress will return to the top. And the whining of the fans will continue.

I listen to Nascar radio on sirius and they have talked about this topic multiple times...David Poole on the Morning Drive has repeated told us that there is NOT a horsepower advantage with Toyota. They said that they think the report got out that they had an advantage when someone said something along the lines of Toyota has x amount more horsepower then the competition...they think that they were saying that its the RANGE of horsepower...the lowest horsepower for (lets say) dodge vs the highest horsepower for toyota. So of course that somehow that gets construde. THERE IS NOT A HORSEPOWER ADVANTAGE....

According to Robin Pemberton: "We take 'em home and dyno 'em. We have the results," Pemberton said. "There is nothing that shows us that anybody has got anybody by a significant advantage. And I think they might have been referring to Truck and Nationwide series more than the Cup Series

Answer 10

NASCAR is a bunch of hypocrites anyway. Last year Chevrolet won 70% or 80% of the races (the stat was on here recently) and everybody's OK with it, it, it's Chevy. But now Toyota (and one Toyota team in particular) is on a hot streak and everybody yells that something's up. NASCAR has been in Chevy's pocket for years. I remember 1985 when Bill Elliot dominated, GM cried and moaned till they got some rules changes to slow down ALL the Ford teams, and Elliot was the only Ford driver who was dominating. Fast forward to 2008 and you have Kyle Busch playing the role of Bill Elliot, and of course all the cry babies are coming out of the woodwork. I hope their precious Chevrolet goes out of business and never races again, what will they cry about then?

Answer 11

There aren't any.

Answer 12

If someone did prove to you you still wouldn't believe it.

Truck Series? Proven

Nationwide series? Proven

Cup Series? It won't be long and it will be proven there too. In fact it was after the Daytona race.

If I was a Kyle fan I would be swearing up and down that it was driver too. Just part of being a fan (stand behind your driver no matter what)

The fact is they have done several tests already and each test showed they have. Every time some Kyle fan wants to post this question I am not going to go digging up links to back up the facts.

Toyota has more horsepower. PERIOD.

Okay bring on the thumbs down Kyle fans. You know it burns you up ...lol ... You are the ones giving all the thumbs down.

Go Jr....!!!

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Oh bestanswer the facts have been shown to ya. Like I said you guys just don't want to believe the facts. That's why I'm not even wasting my time looking for the link.

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For the record... I didn't give anybody a rating (thumbs up or down)... I think it's a useless feature for wimps to hide behind.

Answer 13

Heres, a nationwide series test below,

Answer 14

Sure can't

But NASCAR has tested them a couple of times this season and each time they have said there "was no significant advantage for anyone. Kyle Busch is just that good NASCAR fans, get over it."

Ok, I added the last part about Kyle Busch in, but that's what I would have said

Answer 15

http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story...

http://www.nascar.com/2008/news/headline...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php...

http://www.independenttribune.net/sports...

Answer 16

toyota does have more power. thats just means that ford, chevy, and dodge need to step up. i'm not a toyota fan. but one make of car is always a head every sence the begining. thats the point of racing. whos got the best cars. toyota just got it this year and kyle busch is just on this year too.

Answer 17

I read it on NASCAR.com today, I am too tired/lazy to go look for it for you, but it is there on the website.

Answer 18

Toyota has more horsepower, but not much. Probably 10-20 at the most, like I said in an earlier question about it.

Thinking about it, What about Torque? I'm interested in the torque ratings of each manufacturers engine, that's probably why Dodge isn't doing so good in the Nationwide series, they probably don't have enough get up and go out of the turns like the Toyota's do, either that or the Gibbs guys are building those cars that good, which I don't doubt.

Answer 19

I agree with Tina.

Answer 20

Why wont tina give you her facts? Because she doesnt have any thats why!!!!!

If TOYOTA even DID have any HP advantage its ALL within the RULE BOOKS so its not cheating anyway!!!!!!!!!

Funny how when it comes down to the facts everyone is too tired and lazy to prove their ponts. Let them live in their imaginary world and believe what they want to is all I know to say