Vegans: Sorry, but another animal testing question.?

Question

Again, I'm just trying to fine tune my understanding. If you think I'm badgering then just don't answer.

Many vegans are against animal testing on anything including medicine and medical procedures. But, as animal testing of medicines and procedures is also done for medicines and procedures destined to be used on animals themselves and not humans, I'm compelled to inquire on that issue.

Realizing that testing on animals also is done for medicines/procedures that will be used on animals themselves, is that acceptable or not to vegans? Not "Is it vegan?". But more along the lines of "What are your thoughts?".

Thanks in advance for the even-tempered, mature answers.

Answer 1

In the way of my thinking of being a vegan, animal testing means that an animal may be suffering from the testing. In my reality I put animals not on a pedestal, but on the same playing field as me. That we are all of God's creations and deserve the same respect, liberties, and the pursuit of happiness in our lives.

Yesterday I heard how scientists were making breakthroughs in motorized arms for amputees by testing it on monkeys. Somehow I don't think the scientists just naturally found amputee monkeys to test their machine on. The scientists also wanted the amputees' brainwaves to tell the machine arms what to do. So the scientist also had the motorized arms hooked up to the brainwaves of the amputee monkey.

Eerie thoughts go through ones head with that description. I think they should test this theory/machine in a different way, without the use of monkeys, even if it would be way more difficult and costly in the long run.

But still to take a monkey/animal, damage it by cutting off the arms, and then hardwiring something into its brain is suffering in my book. Suffering of one animal to help the suffering of another one who is suffering because they don't have the ability to use their own arms does not cancel the suffering on both sides. I don't know if that is looking at this situation as a vegan, or just looking at it humanely.

Answer 2

It's a controversial issue at best

Depending on personal commitment and belief,  some vegans probably would take the "no compromise/absolute" stance and disapprove all kinds of animal testing no matter how noble it's purposes might be. Others might take a more toelrant approach, not encouraging the practice but not entirely disapproving of it either. I seriously doubt that you will find anybody who will choose death if not of oneself, that of a loved over the possibility of having a medical cure or treatment derived and/or resarched through animal testing.

However, you have to understand that due to vast improvements in medicine science in particular and science in general, there are now many alternatives to animal testing. In many cases in fact, it is no longer even necessary to test on animals. Nor is it longer necessary to test medicines and procedures developed say more than 50 years ago. Though I have no real moral or ethical outrage over animal testing for medical purposes, I am strongly against testing done for the benefit of vanity products such as cosmetics, shampoos and even medical procedures in the case of "vanity driven" plastic surgery.

As one vegan here always points out (and rightly so) no all vegans are of one mind about everything. Some will disapprove one thing while others may approve of it. Some will be passionate about one thing while others could not care less either way.

Answer 3

I am a vegan and it depends on your personal point of view, every person is different despite being vegan.

It depends if you think it is acceptable to inflict pain on one being (regardless of species) to reduce pain in another.

The reason people think it is acceptable for humans to test on animals is humans are considered to be the more valuable (higher) species coupled with our own personal survival instinct.

I personally believe in natural selection in theory.  If an animal is sick I would not like to make another one suffer.  You would have to look at exactly why we are curing diseases in animals rather than letting nature take its course.  However my maternal instinct would probably over-ride this if it were my pet who were sick.  But then I also believe in voluntary human population reduction, so curing every human disease without a corresponding decline in birth rate would be a disaster for the eco-system.  

So in summary, the moral stance is clear and easy to identify but painful to live by.

Answer 4

Honestly, there are many advances on the horizon that could wipe out animal testing.  Even when the medicine is tested for "animals" it is not always that animal that it's going to be used on.  I.E.: they will still use rats for a dog-specific medicine.

As you probably know, many medicines that have been taken off the market due to human death or serious illness were because the animal testing said that blah percent of rats were "cured".  Well I don't know about you, but my body is very different than a rat, monkey, ape, cat, beagle, etc. This is also true that these animals are very different from each other.

I think this is a great question, and if you want to learn more, visit

AAVS.org

It's a WONDERFUL, insightful website on this issue!

Answer 5

I have no problem with clinical (human) trials that benefit humans, because they involve willing participants. We don't just force people to participate in painful experiments against their will; they know what they're getting into and they receive compensation for their participation. There are safeguards; people can choose to drop out of the study if they desire to do so.

It's more complicated with animal tests to benefit animals. An animal can't volunteer to experience extreme pain and suffering. An animal can't decide that he/she wants to get out of the experiment. I really do have a problem with inflicting pain and suffering on any beings (animals or humans) without their consent. The ends don't justify the means, in my opinion. I'm sure there are some types of human experiments that might be extremely useful, but scientists don't do them because they would be too unethical.

As George Bernard Shaw once said, “You do not settle whether an experiment is justified or not by merely showing that it is of some use. The distinction is not between useful and useless experiments, but between barbarous and civilized behaviour.”

I also agree with veggie-wedgie:

"I'd prefer to see animals succumb to life-threatening illnesses that occur naturally than to see a few animals live a few years longer at the expense of the unbelievable torture of others."

Answer 6

For treatment of a similar issue, consider the "Hippocratic Oath" - this forms a core part of modern medical ethics

Consider for example a doctor not killing a severely mentally handicapped person, even to harvest the bodily organs necessary to save the life of say 10 people injured in a bus crash.

The reasons one can not kill an individual to save many individual are complex to say the least...

Answer 7

I'm not vegan but if I was my opinion would be the same.  The bottom line is that some animal testing is necessary to advance and better not only the well-being of humans but the well-being of animals too.  It is a sacrifice that I am willing to accept so that thousands more can get well or be cured.

On the other hand there is some animal testing that is 'wasteful' and not 'necessary'.  Testing for make-ups and such is crazy to me.  We can all do our part by purchasing all-natural products not tested on animals.

OK...I have read over some peoples theories...people against necessary animal testing should never go to the hospital or doctor for anything.  They should never take pills for anything.  You should stay at home sick and die a slow painful death because you are not worthy to receive medical treatment.  Here is your sign:  ALL medical treatment was founded on research utilizing animals AND even humans for testing.  If you believe its wrong just simply NEVER go to the doctor or hospital for anything...that way you won't be supporting it.  IDIOT.

Answer 8

It's interesting to hear so many humans say that animal testing is a necessary evil that they're willing to accept when it's not their sacrifice to endure.  It's not you torn from your family as a child.  It's not you locked in a cage for weeks, months, years.  It's not you being manhandled and mutilated against your will.  It's not you waiting for death.  It's not you starving for love, companionship, and freedom to simply do what comes naturally to you.

It's an ethical dilemma at best.  Personally, I'd prefer to see animals succumb to life-threatening illnesses that occur naturally than to see a few animals (usually pets or commodities) live a few years longer at the expense of the unbelievable torture of others.

Answer 9

I'm not vegan but in my honest opinion, if it's designed and meant for animals, then to a degree, yes but it's a touchy, ethical issue that can be hard to address whenever you think of the animals in the labs. I find it hard to write my opinion with those kind of thoughts in mind but past that, I believe it's okay.... to a degree.

Answer 10

One example: Vets learn surgical techniques on animals. Would any vegan want to bring their beloved Fluffy, or Rover in for to be operated on by a new vet who has only done the procedure on a computer simulation?

Another example: Would you sign a waver form to let Spot take a new heart worm medicine that has never been tested?

Answer 11

thank you for a respectfully worded question. :)

My thoughts are that the same principle applies. I do not doubt the intent of scientist carrying out these procedures and although the products that are discovered as a result of the test may be brilliant, the "test animal" is still being forced into something against their will and as I have read up on, the animals endure horrific torture in the process.

I would also question the motivation of the humans involved in the tests as I am unable to grasp the thought of putting several hundered rabbits though h**l for the supposed good of rabbits.

These are my thoughts.