What's wrong with liking winners?

Question

Why do Dale Jr. fans call us people that like guys like Kyle Busch, Jeff Gordon, and other guys that WIN races bandwagoners? Maybe we just like winners and personally I dislike Jr. and love it that Kyle is not afraid to race him like anyone else. I've been a fan of Gordon since around 1998 after we went to the Bristol race and everyone booed him and he still won...it's kind of like that now with Kyle Busch. So are Jr. fans just jealous because they don't have a winner to pull for? Or why won't they quit talkin trash about Kyle fans.

Answer 1

Personality seems to rule over talent in NASCAR.  Drivers like Jr, Michael Waltrip, and Elliot Sadler always seem to make the list.  Mikey was in the top 5 last year and he hasn't won a race since 2003 and has a whopping 4 wins in about 25 years.  You can be the worst driver in NASCAR and have 18 DNFs by the end of the year. But if you put on a happy face and make some of the fans chuckle you're automatically a fan favorite.

Personally I'll take a driver with talent.

Answer 2

Nothing at all with liking a winner.  It's when your "winner" starts losing and you jump ship to another "winner" is when it becomes bandwagoning.  

And you just admitted being a bandwagon jumper when you said "I started liking him more when he made the Chase"...if you don't have a driver you can support through the good times and the bad, that's completely up to you, but don't cry when people call you a bandwagoner.

Answer 3

i don't think there's anything wrong with liking winners.  i do think there's something wrong, however, with everyone - particularly a large portion of junior fans - thinking they are the only fans ever who have liked their driver "from the beginning" and through "thick and thin."  that "holier than thou" attitude gets tiring.  

some of us have been watching racing for more than just a few weeks now (and some for more than just a few years, or decades), and not everyone agrees that junior is the be-all and end-all.  i like junior, i root for him, i hope he wins again soon. i respect him as a driver and for how he comports himself on and off the track. i even like him IN SPITE OF his more "radical" fans.  i'm glad to see him running so well this year - sounds like he made a good choice to get out of DEI and to go somewhere where he can focus on winning.  and win he will.

what i don't like is being told that because i like someone newer to the sport, someone who is obviously having the season of his life so far, that i am "less of" a fan than someone else.  i have liked the busch brothers since before kyle hit the cup series - even before he hit any of the major series.  i lived in vegas back about the time kurt hit the "big leagues," and started pulling for the hometown boy.  then "shrub" finally turned 18 and could race the top series again (after getting booted from an truck race in fontana because he was too young) and i was ready.  

and he didn't win everything right out of the chute - but i stuck with both him and his brother, through kurt's rise and fall, and through kyle's climb from 20th in the points in 2005, to 10th in 2006, to 5th in 2007, to where he is now - #1 in the points, at least for the moment.

so now i am enjoying the benefits of having been a fan for all this time - i get to see the driver i have pulled for his whole nascar career go out and dominate.  that's every fan's dream!  anyone who says he/she wouldn't feel the same if his/her favorite driver started doing the same is either a liar, or not much of a fan... i feel that as a long-time fan of his, and of racing long before the busch brothers hit the big leagues, i have every right to be happy, and that other drivers fans have no right to look down at me just because their driver happens to have been around longer, or because he happens to be named earnhardt, or whatever.

a true fan of nascar doesn't knock the fans of another driver just because he is on a winning streak, nor does one knock the fans of a driver when he's on a losing streak. a little trash talk for "$hit$ and giggles," sure; but needless and endless bashing, come on...  and a true nascar fan doesn't sit around preaching about he (or she) are "real fans" and everyone else is just a "bandwagoneer."  that, my friends, is true arrogance.

ps.  sounds like someone needs a nap, know it all (below), and a lesson in math as well as in manners.  kyle has won 7 races.  17-7 = 10, not 11.  and that's just sprint cup. i do want to give you a thumbs up for proving my point to a "T", mr. "only junior fans are loyal and true...everyone else is a bandwagoneer."  and you think kyle is arrogant... well, he may be but at least he has the talent to back it up...do you?

EDIT: winter glory, do you mean you didn't used to see any jr. fans knock a kyle fan, because i see it all over the place (and not because i'm paranoid, that's another matter... ;-)  

maybe SOME jr. fans (i said SOME, not ALL) started knocking kyle fans only recently because of richmond, or jealousy, or whatever...  or maybe because there ARE so many bandwagoneers "visiting" rowdy's world currently ...

there is a quite a bit of generalizing, by a number of jr fans (notice again, i didn't say "all"), about ALL busch fans being bandwagoneers, about ALL busch fans knowing little to nothing about racing, and every now and then someone says something fairly subtle, but something bashing rowdy's world nonetheless.

Answer 4

It's sort of like how it's cool to like a band BEFORE they get too mainstream and everybody likes them.  I liked U2 and REM before they got too popular and they sort of sold out, in my opinion.  I like Jimmie Johnson and have from the get go.  I didn't just start to follow him after his championships or anything.

3 STR8 N 08!!!

Answer 5

There is nothing wrong and I am not a bandwagoner   I Liked elliot because he is from close to where I live and I like Edwards because he started off winning.  I still pull for Elliot and Martin when they race even though they probably won't win

Answer 6

nothings wrong with liking winners. Usually fans will begin to like a driver that has immediate success in NASCAR, and stick with him through thick and thin.

Answer 7

Okay, first of all, nothing wrong with liking a winner, that's the easy part, and it's more fun when you're pulling for a driver who does.

second, as stated above on several different posts, it will be interesting to see how many of Kyle's "fans" are still pulling for him when his hot streak's not so hot, I swear up until just a month ago, it seemed like I was his only fan on here.

third, I don't recall a single post written by a Jr. fan trashing any of Kyle's fans, Kyle, yes, his fans, no.

and lastly, Jr's fans are not jealous, they're true fans who have stuck by their driver during his dry spell, that's what fans do.

Answer 8

I liked Kyle from the first time I saw that kid race.  Last year during the chase, he had the best average finish through about the first five races, until Jr took him out.  When I mentioned that in this forum, the Jr fans piled on me saying that wins, and not best average finish was what counted.  They seem to be singing a different tune this year.  The Jr fans are making a big deal out of the fact that he's with a new team this year, so he's dealing with a learning curve, but he's still driving a Chevy, and he still has the same crew chief.  Kyle has a new team, new car, and new crew chief, but he's also got 3 wins.

Answer 9

Personally, I think that a fan is someone who like the driver win or lose.  And although I can't stand Jr., I have to say his fans are quite loyal.

That being said, I think the whole Busch vs. Jr. thing is ridiculous.  There are 41 other drivers on the track.

I don't think Jr. fans are jealous that they don't have a winner to pull for or they would just switch to liking someone who is a winner.  I think they are mostly just mad because of an accident that was caused by BOTH of them kept him from winning.

It's really not that serious!

Answer 10

Your question is " What's wrong with liking winners?", and you question why you'd be called a bandwagon fan?

Were you preaching about Kyle Busch last year or the year before?

Most of Jr's wins were restrictor plate tracks?

1) Texas

2) Richmond

3)  Daytona

4) Dover

5) Talladega

6) Talladega

7) Talladega

8)  Talladega

9)  Pheonix

10) Daytona

11) Atlanta

12) Richmond

13) Bristol

14) Talladega

15) Pheonix

16) Chicago

17) Richmond.

I see 7 plate wins out of 17.

Better luck next time.

Answer 11

There is nothing at all wrong with liking a winner. In every fans eye's their driver is a winner.

Answer 12

we call people like you bangwagon jumpers because you only claim to be a fan of a driver when he's on a hot streak. were you a kyle busch fan before this year? of course not, and neither were any of the other band wagon jumpers on this forum, kyle busch didn't have any fans before this season. and we all know as soon as the hot streak ends, all of you will disapear, change your screen names, and start claiming to be 'fans' of the next flavor of the month. a real fan sticks with his driver through thick and thin. we were junior fans when he was winning his 17 races (that's 11 more than the scrub) we were junior fans the last 2 years when he was plauged with crappy, sub par equipment, and we're fans now that he's finnally in good equipment, third in points and running up front again every week.

Answer 13

Nobody liked Kyle Busch until he started winning. He acts like an 8 year old prick. Nobody even really likes him now. And to the Gordon thing, he may get booed but if you go to any race his product trailer is lined up with fans. Kyle Busch couldn't win the race at Richmond so his only shot was to push Jr out of the way. He is also mad about getting kicked out of Hendrick. Liking the drivers isn't what upsets people. It's jumping on the bandwagon when a guy starts winning is what people including myself hate.

Answer 14

The same reason that the Cowboys were so popular years ago.

A team(driver) sux for years, then wins a few races. ALL OF A SUDDEN EVERYONE is a fan.

That's why they are referred to as Band wagoners. They jump on and then off the bandwagon.

Let's see how many Kyle fans we have after he loses a few races. I bet it will be pretty quiet.

TBA, he's got you there. 7 out of 17 is not "most", it isnt even 1/2.(41.18% to be exact)

Answer 15

I don't really think you want a answer to your question I think want to keep the ravalry going between the Dale Jr. fans and the Busch fans.  And no one ever stops talking trash it is what we do.  We like winners and we like to talk trash it's human nature.  And aren't you talking trash keeping it going?  Me too for all that matter because I am answering.

Answer 16

To answer the question? There is nothing wrong with liking the winner.

There's nothing wrong with not liking any driver either. We all have our different reasons.  

Example's:

I think Robby Gordon just plain sucks at Nascar and I laugh at him sometimes. But I would stand in the Desert for an hour just to see him fly by in a Baja Truck! The guy is an Off Road Ringer.

I like Jr. because he has a sweet '70 Camaro that HAD to have an undercarriage that he could 'power wash' instead of polished up show stuff because he drives it alot on the back roads where he lives. I like that!

I like Richard Petty because he's the King! He's the guy I grew up worshiping. You become King by winning the most races.....ever! Period! He didn't win One race the last 7 years of his driving career. I followed him anyway. I will always follow the #43. ( the jeff green era was the dark days)

The only thing I like about Kyle Busch, so far, is he can drive a freakin' stock car! Loose, tight, brakes glowing etc. etc.

Jeff Gordon asked Dale Sr. one time why fans bood him. Sr. said to worry about the fans when they stop booing him. Meaning, when they stop booing it's because he's not winning anymore.

Answer 17

You guys aren't doing your averages correctly.  You need to get an average from restrictor and non restrictor tracks before you get an overall percentage.  

Just trying to help the debate.    Let me know if you need help.

Continue...

Answer 18

I have been playing around in YA for quite a while now and Kyle Bush starts winning and all of a sudden there are a 100 Bush fans in here.  THAT is bandwagon jumping my friend.  I haven't pointed fingers at anyone but just pay attention when somebody else gets hot just watch and see how many 'fans' that guy ends up with.  It's a joke.  

I am a loyal fan of Junior's even with his 2 year dry streak I am still right here rooting for him.  If it ends up being 10 years I would still be a fan.  Not just switch off and find someone who is winning.

But tell me why are YOU talking about Junior & his fans?  You don't like him and he can't win, I have heard it a million times so leave it alone.  But NO you have to keep pushing and picking and trashing.  Futhermore I am not jealous of Gordon, Johnson, Hamlin, Martin or any of the other awesome drivers out there.  I pull for a lot of them.  Just because I am a fan of Junior's dosen't mean I can't see past him.  I like a lot of the teams and I have liked Gordon & Johnson for many years.  So as you can see I DO have winners to pull for.  Junior will be a winner & a Champion but will any of the hates here give him an ounce of credit?  Absoutley not.  They will just find other reasons to hate.  

I will be a loyal member of Junior Nation long after the bandwagon pulls away with most of today's Bush fans on it.

Answer 19

It took me some time to mature as a race fan and respect Gordon for the driver he is rather then hate him because he won all the time. I think that anytime you get a popular driver that goes through a slump you get fans that tend to get defensive and quote past glories rather then just sit back and let someone else enjoy the spot light for a while. Granted some of the time the defensiveness is a reaction to the winning drivers fans going on the offensive and "kicking them while they are down". If fan could learn to do what we teach our kids "Cheer for your team, not against the opponent" then alot of this posturing and $hit talking could be avoided. ("So are Jr. fans just jealous because they don't have a winner to pull for") is a perfect example of $hit talking that just not needed. 1. Jr has more wins then Kyle. 2. Jr the driver is way more humble and classy then Kyle is at this point in his career. fans might be a different story, but you aren't changing any minds on that front my man.

I like Jr as a person and as a driver, but i don't cheer for him to win. Now saying that in a junior friendly environment would get me 2 responses. 1. "you're stupid, you're driver sucks, Jr rules" or 2. "Oh, who do you cheer for?....Cool, he's a pretty good driver too".  I see 1 way more often then i see 2.  Answer 1 tends to get a very different response then 2.  Now I don't have anything against either driver (kyle or jr) but the $hit talking is getting old.