Question:

What decides whether or not something 'exists'?

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Try to avoid using words like 'real', and of course, 'exist'.

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  1. Descartes tried to ask this question and came to the conclusion, at least his first conclusion, that only one 'thing' can be proven to exist: "Cogito, ergo sum!" I think, therefore I must exist. Plato concerned himself with "forms", supposing that the form of a table, or a chair, or any object does not change in the universe; but that what we see on this plane as a table, chair, etc. may.

    This is actually one of the elements discussed by Pirsig and his Metaphysics of Quality.

    What I've drawn from reading these works, and even trying to come to my own treatise, is that there is only two things that I can prove exist and are real.

    1: I can prove that I exist.

    2: I am ignorant as to everything else.

    Not quite an answer to your question, but can we ever really prove something exists?


  2. Do you mean "What determines whether or not something 'exists' "?

  3. i do. i decide whether a "something" exists in my life.Ü

  4. Not all things that exist exist in the empirical world. Some exist in the intellect only, as ideas. But all things that have existence are called "existents."

    The Atomists claimed atoms existed 2500 years before they were proved to exist. So perhaps the decision rests on empirical "proof."

    But there seems to be some great disagreement on the empirical "proof" of global warming. Hundreds of scientists have even "proved" that the earth has COOLED over the last 2 years more than enough to make up for the rise in the last 100 years. If the solar flares have not started yet (last time I checked they were more than a year overdue), then we are in for a very cold and severe winter, much like the one China and other parts of the world had. There was still snow on the mountains in Washington and Colorado as late as June of this year, and the ice at the South Pole is 17 inches thicker than ever recorded.

    In a case like that, it is up to you and your powers of reason to discern what "exists." But if you can hold it in your hand or your mind, or sit on it, or use it as a cause, or cause it as an effect, it must necessarily be an existent.

    But then, the champion of reason and Objectivism, Ayn Rand, always said it was up to you, anyway.

  5. Good one. I asked if matter and energy exist if god exists because, it seems like, if god exists, then this is all a projection or sham. People totally didn't get it.

    The fact that we have these words are defacto proof of them. Without a state of existence, we could not make words at all. However, you are correct in the respect that the words may not mean what we think they do. That's why I said "defacto" ("for all intents and purposes")

    IF this is all an "illusion" - it is what we are doing right now. If if our only way to gain understanding of it is to look at evidence that is, also, an illusion - well, it's all we have.

    My problem with believing in a deity is that it spoils the immersive nature of "existence". It's as if we all decided to play a game of cards and some people are going on and on about what they are going to do or where they are going to go after the game is over. What fun is that?

  6. consensus.

    If no none believes something exists . . . .it doesn't.

  7. Your sense fo humour :-D

  8. This that exist, by definition, have impact on other things. We can see the interactions of things with other things, even if we cannot see the things directly.

    The minute we have to take the existence of something on mere faith or someone else's say-so, there's a good chance that thing doesn't exist.

    Some 'things' that  seem to exist, or merely perceptual illusions.  Does a rainbow 'exist'. You understand that no two people see the same rainbow. What 'exists' in this case, is a principle... the scattering of light by  prismatic particulates.

    In my opinion, this is a good question that will help people learn how to think.

  9. Your perception of it for humans.    We can not perceive ultimate reality, Plato's Form, so we can never know if a thing exists in itself.

  10. If two or more people agree and can describe some characteristics both have experienced. However, one individual experiencing something not experienced by others is reality to that person...and his reaction to it can be described by others.

  11. your perceptions determine whether or not something "exists" for you.

  12. Empirical evidence often comes in handy.

  13. If you can physically see, feel, smell, taste or hear it, it exists.

  14. Scientific proof... otherwise it's called faith or theory.

  15. Human imagination

  16. It is ourselves, through our very own senses, and conciousness in our will and judgements towards something possibly visible.

  17. You do. Existence is relative

  18. a prove,example,fact..

    and sense

  19. Whether it or someone else is aware of its own existence.

    "I think, therefore I am."

  20. Its a living being....?

  21. It takes two to tango.  The other entity decides.

  22. Which thing can decide?

  23. I'm trying to avoid!

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