What is the physical proof of the double-hit foul?

Question

My understanding is that if the cue ball and object ball are close together and in line with the pocket, and if the cue ball is stroked with follow through, the ONLY way you can get both balls to travel at the same time at about the same speed and roughly the same direction...is if your cue tip contacts the cue ball twice. Is that not the proof of a double-hit foul? On a legal follow shot, the object ball takes off well before the topspin propels the cue ball forward...correct? I encounter this situation occasionally and the call is usually met with "Bar rules!"...but does anyone know of any bar rules, published, posted or otherwise, where foul shots like this are specifically indicated as acceptable? My understanding is that this is a foul under basic pocket billiard rules (like that stupid scoop-under "jump" shot) regardless of whether you're playing bar rules or the real rules and that it's just overlooked because bangers have never bothered to actually read the rules.

Answer 1

OK It's 4am but i will try to decypher this you seem to be over lapping 2 sets of rules

World standard rules-Yes it is a foul if less than the thickness of a peice of chalk between the two balls also true if the cue folloes the object ball it will be a double hit-The so called jump shot would be classed as illegal.you have to strike down on the ball for a legal jump shot

Im wearing out my typing finger here but NOT AT 4 Inches I hope you mean a double hit with the cue stick !!and not the cue ball hitting the object ball twice that would be legal.that would just be a follow shot

Bar Rules are a joke as im sure you know but the D hit is usualy overlooked the jump shot is still not legal but try to tell them they dont always listen and I have the scars to prove it

Bar rules in general are so diffrent from place to place it would be hard to give a real answer .The best thing to do is ask before the game if there is money on it or put your quarters in and play it by ear-Myself I would ask first even if just for a beer

But your last part is right they are not trying to cheat or anything like that they just simply dont know the diffrence.

Talk about being in the middle I am a BCA ref and a bar owner .Think I dont have mixed feelings

Answer 2

You guys answered in regards to BCA and Valley rules, but the APA still doesn't recognize a push shot as a foul.

I agree with Johnny on establishing the rules prior to playing.

Answer 3

You are correct in assuming it is a double hit when the cue ball follows the object ball at the same speed and basically the same line. In a real tournament or in league you could call a foul every time.

"Bar rules" is an entirely different animal though. Pretty much everything except picking up the ball (and playing safeties) is legal in bar rules. No, you will not find a written set of bar rules because they are just made up rules and every person's version is different. You cannot assume basic pocket billiards rules apply in bar rules because bar rules only cover whatever is in the pea-brain of your opponent, and since he doesn't know that's a foul, he will say it's not according to bar rules.

My advice is to just go with it when playing for fun, but if there's money on the table tell you him only play real (BCA or whatever league you're in) rules, and only bangers play bar rules.