Question:

Who's in charge of the government if all in the line of succession are killed? How high can a foreigner reach?

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I was reading an article about possible presidential running mates that ranged from senators, congressmen, CEO's and governors and it got me thinking about the Presidential Line of Succession and the highest post a foreign born citizen can hold in the US.

As it stands, the VP would inherit the presidency, should they be no longer able to perform their duties, followed by the Speaker of the House, President Pro Tempore of the Senate, Secretary of State, Treasury, Defense, Attorney General and further followed by all the heads/Secretaries of all the other Federal departments.

To be President, you have to be a natural born citizen, over 35, lived stateside continuosly for the past 14 years.

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  1. According to Madeleine Albright, former Secretary of State under President Bill Clinton and a German-born naturalized citizen, it simply skips over anyone who doesn't fit the requirements for President.

    While she would normally have been in line as Secretary of State, the line would skip over her because she was born in Germany.

    I assume that even if Arnold Schwarzenegger were VP, it would skip over him as well, being that he is an Austrian-born naturalized citizen.  I doubt McCain would even be allowed to pick him.

    As far as resigning as a member of the Legislative Branch; you're technically right.  But if we got to the point to where one of them is to become President, I believe we'll have much bigger problems on our hands than these technicalities.  I think most of us will overlook the fact that they must resign from Congress before becoming President; and in the time between the resignation and the Presidential swearing-in they are technically just private citizens again.


  2. If the president, vp, speaker, pres-pro-tem and cabinet officers were all simultaniously incapacitated the presidency would be vacant.  Command of the US armed forces would rest with multiple senior military commanders (not the joint chiefs, as they are not technically in the chain of command). As none of these officers has the authority to federalise national guard units, the governors of each state would have significant command and control over domestic military forces.  

    State governors would be constitutionally required to appoint replacement Senators and could do so almost immediately.  The new Senate would elect one of their number president-pro-tempore, and this person would become Acting President of the United States (note they would not become the president, but would merely act as president until one of the vacant offices higher than pres-pro-tem in the line of succession was filled).  The Acting President would be empowered to appoint new cabinet officers, who could be confirmed by the replacement Senate.  A Vice President (who would immediately become president) could not be appointed however until special elections had been held to replace the House of Representatives, as both the House and the Senate are required to vote on a VP.  So the Senate president pro-tempore would act as president until such time as a special election was held for the vacant House of Representatives; then the new House would elect a Speaker, who could (if he chose to do so) take over as acting president.  It would probably be more likely that the speaker would allow the pres-pro-tem to continue to act as president since replacing him would mean resigning from the House, and when the House and Senate voted in a new VP that person would automatically replace the acting president and actually become President.  So I imagine in the extremely unlikely event of all in the line of succession being taken out, and there being no Congressmen or Senators alive to become Speaker/Pres-pro-tem and act as president; then the Governors would immediately appoint new Senators and the new Pres-pro-tem would act as president until a specially elected House of Reps was installed and both houses were able to vote on a Vice President, who would then immediately become President.

    As for the other issues you raised:  The Twelfth Ammendment to your constitution makes only people eligable to become president eligable for vice president.  So Governor Schwarzeneger is constitutionally barred from being VP due to his not being a US citizen from birth.  A naturalised citizen is eligable for any other position but would be omitted from the line of succession, so the acting presidency would skip over them to the person next in line, as you rightly said about Madeline Albright when she was secretary of state.

    There is a lot of debate about whether the constitution and law are adequate given the type of threats faced in the modern world and the need for a constant clear chain of command.   As you pointed out it is not clear if the Speaker and President-pro-tem are eligable for inclusion in the line of succession.  There are 2 main issues here:  

    Firstly, as James Madison stated way back in 1792, the constitution requires that the law say which order Officers of the United States succeed to the presidency - but the constitution seems to suggest that only executive and judicial branches are Officers of the United States.  If this is the case then laws including legislative officers (Speaker and Pres-pro-tem) are unconstitutional.

    Secondly, there is a seeming paradox in that either would have to resign from office so as not to be serving in 2 branches at the same time, but of course having resigned how can they still be in line to succeed by virtue of an office they no longer hold.  From what I have read it is assumed that their resignation from Congress would only take effect upon them becoming Acting President, so there is no time between them leaving the Congress and assuming the powers of president, the two happen simultaniously.

    However since neither problem has been taken to court and there is no ruling available, also since no one but the VP has ever had to become president there is no precedent to guide us.  It makes for a significant potential problem should it ever happen - imagine a cabinet member of one party arguing in the Supreme Court that the Speaker (of another party) had no right to inherit the presidency = Constitutional crisis.

    Actually a major think-tant in 2003 highlighted an amazing SEVEN potentially major problems that could trigger a constitutional crisis:

    1) Modern weapons mean that there is the possibility of every  person in Washington DC being unable to serve, and the entire US Government is based there.

    2) Doubts like James Madison's that Congressional officers are eligible to act as President.

    3) Concern about the wisdom of including the President pro tempore in the line of succession as the "largely honorary post traditionally held by the longest-serving Senator of the majority party." For example in 2001 the President pro tempore was 98-year-old Strom Thurmond.

    4) A concern that the current line of succession can force the presidency to abruptly switch parties mid-term, as the Speaker and the President Pro Tempore are not necessarily of the same party as the President.  In the event of a president beying removed from office by impeachment and conviction, when the vice presidency is vacant, the congressional officers would have a conflict of interest and the ability to put themselves into power - coup d'etat.  This was a concern during the Nixon administration before Ford was appointed VP.

    5) The line of succession is ordered by the dates the executive departments were created, with no regard to the skills or capacities of the persons serving as their Secretary.  For example the Secretary of Homeland Security is probably more qualified than that of Agriculture, who is higher in the line.

    6)  Should a Cabinet member begin to act as President, the law allows the House to elect a new Speaker (or the Senate, a new President pro tempore), who could in effect remove the Cabinet member and assume the office him/herself at any time.

    7)  The absence of a provision where a President is disabled and the Vice Presidency is vacant (for example, if an assassination attempt simultaneously wounded the President and killed the Vice President), or where a former President ineligible to be elected as President and Vice President is Speaker or President pro tempore and is in line to succession of the Presidency.

  3. When that many people get killed, it doesnt matter. did u really expect any1 to read all that?

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