Who else is tired of those darn toyotas in nascar?

Question

jeff c--i agree,competion----how much do you think it is the car winning and not the driver?

Answer 1

Nope, Hamlin and Gibbs Racing is winning in both seriess so I will not complain and Benson is winning in trucks. I can't argue with it but they are a well developed racing team that people are going to have to get used to.

Answer 2

ya know, i like competition and think honda should try getting into nascar with the accord.

Answer 3

Im not....makes the racing competiton better....

Id rather see a Yoter win before a c**p Ford any day

FORD  =  WORST VEHICLE EVER MADE

Answer 4

Right; how realistic is that. A rear wheel V8 Camry. Oh wait; they are all based on V6 front wheel drive cars. The whole thing is fake! What was I thinking?

"MATT" Duh; the Monte Carlo is a front wheel driver too.

Answer 5

Nope, not me!

Answer 6

not me, and not just because my boy is winning in one - i think he can win in anything, and he has - chevy, toyota, truck, car, cot, late model, etc. i just wish honda would hurry up and entry the fray as well.

and glycerine (above), your argument holds so little water it should be called a sieve. let's look at where the money goes. chevy and ford have their cars built and/or assembled in other countries and pay the workers there less than they would have to here (otherwise, why would they do it?). all the money comes back here to whom, a few corporate fat cats more concerned with the bottom line than with the plight of the american auto worker. toyota and honda, on the other hand, have factories here in america (and elsewhere in the world). and the majority (80%+) of the toyotas and hondas sold in the states are made (not assembled, but manufactured as well) in the states. look it up at the source below. toyotas kentucky factory builds over 500,000 cars and 500,000 engines per year.

"In the beginning, the engines were shipped from Japan, however, an on-site engine plant was added in 1990. It presently builds the Avalon, Camry, and Camry Solara coupe and convertible. The factory also produces 4-cylinder and V6 engines and powertrain parts with an annual capacity of 500,000 vehicles and 500,000 engines."

and who gets paid for that - american auto workers, probably for union wages (or at least decent wages). yes, the "profit" after costs - many of which also go to americans like the salesmen and owners of toyota and honda dealerships - goes out of the country to a few fat cats outside the states.

so really, in which situation are more american workers benefitting? the one where their jobs are outsourced to foreign countries or those who have jobs thanks to companies from foreign companies. that gm and ford's executives make a ton of money does very little good compared to how many workers they put out of work by sending their jobs to mexico and canada. sorry, the "us" vs "them" argument just doesn't cut it anymore...

EDIT: "nn12mrc" (below), you missed the point of my argument. if you don't like me putting "canada" in it, take it out. debating the intricacies of trade between canada, the us, and mexico is far beyond the scope of this discussion. the trade relations between the US and mexico are vital as well - the more jobs the US sends down there, the fewer problems (in theory) the US will have with illegal immigration from there. and the trade relations between the US and china dwarf them both. the only relevant point here is that US auto makers export their jobs to other countries, benefiting the workers in those countries, but not benefitting any auto workers in the US - doesn't matter whether they export those jobs to canada, sweden, mexico, china, or sweatshops in malaysia. bottom line, no american auto workers benefit from it.

honda and toyota on the other hand, realized long ago that americans would find it far more "palatable" to buy a "foreign name plate car" if the majority of those cars sold in the US were made in the US - so they set up plants in the US - using american auto workers - to build the majority of cars sold here. THAT benefits american auto workers. what the big american auto makers do by outsourcing those jobs to other countries (wherever they may be) is line their own pockets (and their shareholders pockets) - generally at the expense of american auto workers.

bottom line, i don't really care one way or the other what manufacturer is "allowed" to compete in nascar. i'm going to cheer for my favorite drivers whether they drive chevys, toyotas, fords, or dodges - in fact, i have. i cheered on kurt in a ford and in a dodge, and i have cheered on kyle in chevys and in toyotas. and none of this is going to make me buy anything other than a honda, acura, or toyota. if there was a "patriotism" test required by auto manufacturers in order to get approval to run in nascar, most of the american auto companies would probably fail given their practices outlined above...

EDIT II: "nn12mrc," as i said before, if mentioning canada in my argument bothers you so much, then take it out - that doesn't affect my argument AT ALL. my argument is not aimed at canada nor at you - i couldn't care less where the cars are actually built. my argument is with people who want to claim that toyota doesn't belong in an american sport and try to claim that they are "less american" because they are not "american owned." my point IS that whether or not they are american owned, they provide american auto workers jobs, whereas the big three in the US moved most of those jobs out of the US beginning decades ago. where they moved them TO doesn't matter in my argument - where they moved them FROM does. places like detroit and flint lost tons of jobs and the cities (particularly places like flint as depicted in the "documentary" "Roger & Me") were turned into ghost towns. as for canadian jobs being lost because of the big three closing up shops, you're going to have to carry on the good fight there... i don't think many people who are griping about toyota being in the series nor the others complaining about the loss of american jobs care that much about whether a factory in canada closes. i'm not necessarily one of those people - that's who my argument is aimed at, not you...

and your statement that 4600 jobs were lost when the plant in oshawa closed proves the point all the more - what were those jobs doing in canada instead of the US in the first place?  i know they are not moving jobs there NOW - they did that decades ago. and why? because it cost the automakers less to use canadian labor than american labor. now that they can't afford canadian labor, they are shutting down towns there just like they did here in michigan decades ago. and if those jobs are moving anywhere, i guarantee it's not back to the US. if they are being moved, it's to places where the labor is cheaper still, because of a favorable currency exchange rate or because workers in other countries will work for far less per hour than an american or now a canadian auto worker would.

i've got nothing against canada or mexico or any other country. i do have something against people who think that the big three auto makers are the "be all and end all" and should be the only ones allowed in nascar because they are "american owned." personally, i don't care where the cars are made - i'm buying my honda, acura, or toyota no matter where it is made... but for those who do care about "amurican jobs" they should notice that while the big three were exporting jobs over the past few decades, companies like toyota and honda have been creating jobs for american auto workers.

and finally, citing a story from a marxist publication probably isn't going to win you many american fans, no matter how true the story is. and your statements about mexico are insulting, whether you put "no offense intended" in front of it or not. my statements about jobs having been moved to other countries, primarily canada and mexico, was in no way a slap in the face to either country - it was just pointing out the fact that the jobs were moved to other countries. if you feel insulted that canada is mentioned in the same sentence as mexico, that's your "self-image" problem, not mine. and if i was a mexican i would be highly offended by your comments. i didn't put down either canadian workmanship nor mexican workmanship when building cars for the big three - i assume those things are controlled most likely by american quality control managers. if anyone, i was putting down the american auto makers for moving the jobs out of america in the first place, and those people who still worship the big three as true "amurican" companies.

Answer 7

It's the driver not the car. And the proof is the fact that Tony Stewart isn't winning in a Toyota. Kyle Busch is making his team mate look like a fool. Excuse me for sounding so harsh, but i'm tired of the lame excuse that Tony doesn't win until late in the season. Kyle Busch is on fire and it's his turn to shine. Besides how can you be tired of somthing  (Toyota in NASCAR) that's still in it's infancy? Or is this question, in fact based off of sarcasm. Either way, your going to learn something here.

Answer 8

sToyota is hear to stay, get used to it. I wasn't a fan at first, but seeing the improvements from last year to this year, shows they are serious about this.

To: #18s #1 Fan (Rowdy's World)'s, you better think again if you think US Canadians are getting all the jobs to build GM and Ford. Guess it is only okay for Canadians to build cars when the U.S. dollar is worth .40 cents more than ours. And the fact you would even toss Canada into the same sentence as Mexico is insulting. For one, even if we weren't closing plants (which we are) we would still produce a better product than Mexico (no offense to Mexican workers in Mexico). Whether you like it or not the U.S. and Canadian economies are tied together, so when U.S. owned companies close doors in the U.S. you can bet your *** they close some in Canada too.

Edit - (Quote from #18s #1Fan) that gm and ford's executives make a ton of money does very little good compared to how many workers they put out of work by sending their jobs to mexico and canada.

Again Canada has been building cars for American automakers for 40+ years and now plants are closing so how is it that they (GM and Ford) are sending work north of the border? And who's jobs did we take?

I never had a problem with you just pointing out where I disagree with your comments. So if you think that Canada had jobs sent here at the cost of American jobs, I would ask you to think again, the jobs that are left here have been here for many many years, they weren't "created" when the downswing happened. So in short Canada didn't take jobs or get jobs from outsourcing American jobs.

With the most recent Oshawa plant closing that has cost 4,600 people their jobs directly related to that closing alone. Indirectly thousands more. So again I ask where are all these jobs that you say Canada is getting from outsourcing?

Answer 9

I think toyota shouldn't have been allowed into an American sport such as Nascar and I am definitely tired of the toyotas in nascar and please dont say they are as american as a gm,ford or dodge they are not they might be made here but where does that profit go, back home to japan,but toyota better watchout next season because of this new engine chevy will be racing.      

Answer 10

You know, I was against them coming into the series at first. But without competition we're driving in circles right??? So I am glad I have a mfg to hate again...used to be Ford but I don't think they race any more??? Oh wait, they show up...right? Poor Jack Roush.

Answer 11

Definitely me!  They are using larger engines then Chevy, Dodge, and Ford.  

Answer 12

Why????   My guy is winning in one.  lol

Answer 13

Why would we be tired of the toyotas when everyone who is driving one is doing so well

Answer 14

if ya don't like don't watch it  

Answer 15

Not me!   I laugh like a maniac every time that Shrub wins in one.  

Let me get this straight.  You Toyota haters are tired of Toys in NASCAR.   hmmmmmm  Is this because they are a "foreign" made car?  <never mind the fact that more parts and assembly is done here in the good ol USA>

Interesting. What about all your NASCAR memorabilia that is made in CHINA or in sweatshops in Taiwan?????

Oh well, everyone is entitled to their own opinion right?  

Mine is Toyotas are gonna be in NASCAR longer than bowties at this point!

Answer 16

I'm tired of it! It's getting repetitive!

Answer 17

Why are you tired of something that is going to force the other manufacturers to make better cars and work harder to keep their cars in nascar.   Right now, Toyota has the best cars in Nascar, and if you kicked them out, it would be because the "foreign" Manufacturer is making better cars.  

Just wanna add something to what #18 said above me here.....

If You want nascar to be Only the american "owned" Companies, then you might as well kick dodge out now as well as toyota, since dodge is owned by DAIMLER Chrysler, which is a GERMAN Company.    And with GM in the financial shape its in, they could very well be bought out by a foreign company soon.   There was a serious push by nissan's parent company last year, and GM barely managed to fight them off.   So, you might be needing to kick chevy out of nascar soon too.  

There is no such thing as a purely American Car now.  

Also, I'm as patriotic as the next guy, but I'm not going to feel bad about buying a "foreign" Vehicle that is Manufactured less than 200 miles from my home and keeps thousands of working americans with jobs in my region of the country, when my other options are to buy "American" vehicles that are manufactured hundreds or even thousands of miles away, and possibly in another country.  especially not when the "foreign" vehicle is better according to almost every automotive magazine out there.

Answer 18

I think your just getting jealous of all the Toyota's winning.

Answer 19

Nope!

Answer 20

Me!

Chevys gotta win more!

Answer 21

I sure am....I think it's funny how these so called Kyle fans never showed up until he was winning. "Followers"

Answer 22

I dont like it at all. I mean I dont think a foreign company should be in an American Sport. Thats just me though. Too much controversy and I dont like that at all. I'm a Chevy person, and I would love to see Jeff Gordon along with all the other Hendrick guys do great.... I mean I dislike Kyle Busch, and Tony Stewart didnt like Toyotas so thats why he's going back to Chevy.. Its all working out.. Eventually the other car makes will catch up.