Why do SOME guys consider the 270 win too small on elk but something like a 7MAG or '06 is ideal?

Question

Aren't they pretty close of you handload. I can't see how a 160gr NP at 2866fps from a 270 win is not enough. Thanks.

Answer 1

My Dad is a big hunter and he owns a 270. win and he has been hunting moose since he was 21 years old and now hes 47. The people he hunts with have 30-06, 7mm mag, 300 win mag, and a 308. My dad has killed more moose then all of them. He has killed around 5-8 moose and everyone else has killed 2-4 moose.

He uses a 150. grain and it has done the job just right. I think it will work perfectly

Answer 2

It comes down to personal preference. I prefer the 30-06 over the 270 and 7 Mag.

Answer 3

hi there

got to say it, some folks just think bigger is better. my 270 has dropped everyting from foxes to moose . there are no elk in my area or they would fall under my 150's no problem .

Answer 4

First of all, I think you mean 30-06.  This round hits a lot harder than a .270 but does not shoot as flat.  And the 7mm mag is in a class by itself far above both the others.  The 7mm mag has a much higher velocity than a .270 and hits harder than the 30-06.  I've flipped animals off their feet with my 7mm and they never got back up.  The entrance wound is the size of a softball.  It's definitely something I would recommend.  As far as the .270 being too small, I say that's c**p.  A .270 will kill any animal on this earth.  It just requires a well placed shot.  In Wyoming for instance, you are not allowed to hunt elk with a .270 unless you are a guide or an experienced hunter and a lot of these guides do use a .270

Answer 5

my manuals give a 160 grain NP from a 270 at 2764.  I am not suprised that a handloader can push it 100 fps beyond that, but normally when you really push for high velocities, you degrade accuracy.  Also pushing it that fast, you have very high chamber pressures, higher than the 7mm remmag, because of the smaller space being used.  My book also lists a 160 gr NP from a 7mm remington mag as going at 2900, and a handloader can probably push that to 3000 fps.

Both are adequate for elk, but the 7mm rem mag can do what the 270 winchester does, just out farther.

But then, the 7x57, aka the 7mm mauser, is about 100-150 fps less than the 270, and that is adequate for elk too. It's done the job many times.  And the 7mm-08 is about 100-150 fps less than the 7x57, and that is adequate too, and the 7-30 waters, which is a 30-30 necked down to a 7mm bullet, well, that is about 150 fps less than the 7mm-08, etc etc

How long can you keep on shaving off 100 to 150 fps before you reach something that is inadequate?

Answer 6

Lots of folks use 270 successfully, and 150 or 160 grain bullets will penetrate like crazy, but it is a small caliber, and frontal area does count for something. Let's face facts: bigger bullets make bigger holes. If I didn't have anything bigger, I certainly wouldn't feel bad about using something in the 6.5-7mm range, but I can grab whatever size bore I want out of the back room, so I'd usually pick something bigger.

Answer 7

Erich-

Its a matter of who you look at making the kill humane.  Yes I just used foul language in the hunting section, by saying the word humane.

I hunt here in California, and have used my .308 Winchester for just about everything.  

I also have a Reminton 700 chambered for .270.  I have taken many deer with this rifle, same to be said with my .308.

However, when it comes to large game, I really have no desire to chase them through the brush, then tend a case of poison oak for three or four weeks afterwards.  

Having said this, I tend to use the larger faster calibers for the larger game.  Yes shot placement is VERY important, but energy delivery is too, and equally so.  My Elk Rifle is a 7mm Remington Magnum, and since I have started using this rifle, they stay where they lay.  There is no more chasing the wounded animal while the bleed out.  

Its merely a matter of the bullet's downrange residual energy.  

Here is my case and point.  I also do Wild Boar Hunting.  Many of the gents I go with use Hollow points or soft point spitzers.  They used to always question my jugdement for using a, (.308 Winchester), 147 Grain Winchester Power Point Bullet with a flat nose.

20 pigs later that did not have to be chased over the hill for a mile, they understand.  

One of the things that many folks overlook when developing a hunting cartridge is bullet profile.  This is manly because they are told about a really good brand, or bullet type and they just go with that.  I have never been that type of person.  I explore all of the literature on them, then start handloading and doing some shooting.

Being that I have property, I have no issues with purchasing some meat, and putting some bullets into it at range then documenting the results.  

Basically what I have found is that if you have a bullet profile that provides good penetration, that is all well and good.  But the issue is making the animal receive enough initial shock from the bullet strike that it goes into immediate shock and dies.  The trick is finding the correct profile to deliver enough "Slap" to do exactly that.  

The sharp pointed bullets are all well and good, but in my experience, they provide very little primary shock delivery when they strike the target.  

Here is my case and point.  The large African Game Rifles, (500 Nitro Express and their ilk), have a large bullet, but the bullet profile is not sharp.  Its round like a Musket Ball, not like the .50 BMG Bullet.  The reason is because they want the bulet to deliver a huge slap and sudden energy impact that totally overwhelms the animals system.  

You pretty much want that when you are hunting Cape Buffalo, or any other large game.  

So I started experimenting with my own bullet profiles, and found the same logic applies here.  

Your .270, with the correct bullet weight AND profile will deliver excellent results, and yes you should be able to take an Elk with it.  But I would recommend that you load to the Maximum SAAMI recommendations, with a fairly heavy bullet.  This does mean that you may have to get in a little closer, but you should be able to get your animal.

Just remember, you want to bring this animal down quickly, and with as much mercy as possible.  This is one reason I quit hunting deer with my .243.  I got tired of chasing them, then having to do a follow up shot, if it was a fairly large buck.

Hence my reason for switching to my .270 and .308.

The only reason, I got a 7mm Remington Magnum was to be dead sure that the Elk or Moose was going to stay where they lay.  

Good luck on your next hunt.

Answer 8

Psychologists have quaint names for people who shift their view of reality for political or ego purposes. Bottom line: as Jack O'Connor said repeatedly, the 270 with the 150 grain bullets makes the same field results as both the 308 and 30-06 with 150 grain bullets, and people have repeatedly failed to be able to distinguish between them all in repeated tests. All those elk taken just fine with 270's with 130 grain bullets because someone got confused and used from the wrong ammo box, never knew the difference either. Psychologists have even quainter names for people who build rumors upon lies of people selling bigger guns, most of whom have no field experience with real game, and call that multilayered nonsense reality. The reloading manuals got much of this started by overgunning the public, hoping to avoid loss of reputation from hunt failures from bad hits blamed on underloads. A bad hit caused by too much recoil from too much gun is not usually covered by the extra power. Those who say it is are in the majority, however. And this is the difference between lore and savvy. One makes big expensive booms, the other gets results. I see that you are not fooled by the tidal wave of bluster, and I suspect that you are one of those who gets results. Regards, Larry.

Answer 9

The key to that is "[if] you handload". Usually when someone handloads a round, it is of very high quality and therefore shoots much better and truer, not to mention you can tune the round to the exact specs you desire. Factory ammo usually comes short of that because it is mass produced by machines. It also has a lot to do with who you talk to, there are some people who think it is perfectly acceptable to hunt deer with a .22LR. My view of this matter is that the .270 is probably the smallest end of the scale elk-wise, but if you are confident you can pull it off ethically then why not?

Answer 10

The .270 and 30/06 are very close, and it's just a trade off as far as speed and grain bullet practical to shoot from each. The .270 has it speed wise and is pretty flat (as well as being more accurate just because it's a great cartridge combination) and the 30/06 can get out there with more energy delivered, a bit more.

The 30/06 makes a 10% bigger hole and so the target absorbs a little more damage if each passes through. The 30/06 also does a bit more damage, just a bit, if it remains in the body, though the faster .270 mushrooms better, so it's really a toss up on which performs better, and depends on the shot and all the variables that can go with each shot. The 30/06 does have a small advantage on average over all once the target is hit as far as total energy delivered to the target, but it's small and variable. I have 2 .270s and no 30/06, mostly because I like the natural accuracy the .270 round carries over the 30/06.

The 7mm rem mag is in a totally different class, and neither the .270 nor 30/06 can touch it. 7mm really is better for elk, not that .270 or the 30/06 can't do the job (any argument about .270 being much less than the 30/06 is just stupid because the difference is insignificant, so I won't even address that). It's like he .270 or 30/06 for deer are without a doubt enough gun for the job, but some think the .243 is a tad small. The .243 is still a great dear cartridge, but it's a little smaller and in the same hit the .243 might not bring an animal down, where the .270 or 30/06 would dump them. That compares with the case of the 7mm being better for Elk than the .270. The .270 is just a little on the short side of the energy delivered to the target for elk, but it still does the job very well, if you get a good shot in.

How someone kills 5-8 or 2-4 moose is beyond me lol. Sounds like a total crock. Anyone killing a moose remembers it well. Killing 5-8 moose is like having 3 to 6 divorces, you just remember those things better than that.

Answer 11

Well friend it's all about shot placement . You no doubt could kill an elk without any trouble with a .243, but a lot of people just shoot instead of waiting for the right shot. These other rounds have more energy to compensate for a less than perfect shot. So aim ,aim ,aim til the bullet hits the animal no matter what it is and squeeeeeeeze the trigger.

Answer 12

A .270 is plenty of gun for elk if you hit the mark the biggest advantage that a 7MAG or an '06 has is more knock down power than a .270 but like i said if your hit your mark it works just fine I have seen several elk killed with a .270 by my family members.