Why do so many people think Electric Cars are best?

Question

Electric Power Plants that produce the electricity and pollute are 30-35% efficient (Energy in fuel to Electric energy out). One of the new Turbo Diesels are also about 33% efficient.

The power from the power plant then goes through the following added efficiency losses: Power Line Losses, Transformer loss twice (to 14KV and to 220V), Battery Charger losses, Battery Storage losses, then actual motor losses.

How can the electric car possibly be as efficient as a diesel in reducing CO2 emissions? On top of that, the diesel is much less expensive, has very long range, and no re-charge time. It also does not have the battery life / replacement problems.

Why do people want to pay more money to pollute more?

Answer 1

An electric motor doesn't Idle when it is sitting in traffic,  at stop lights and stop signs.  An electric motor doesn't use energy to shift gears (no gears).  An electric motor doesn't need to expend energy on smog pumps and turbochargers.  You confuse the issue when you discuss energy loss, then discuss relative pollution.  Most people realize that electric drives pollute also.  Electric cars are not the final solution, but they are a better solution than the internal combustion engine.  (In the near term, plug in hybrids are the better solution.)

Answer 2

Because the myth of the non-polluting electric car is a "feel-good" thing to some people...

Answer 3

How many times do I have to explain this to you?

I don't have my link to the studies proving that EVs produce lower CO2 emissions with the current power grid mix than gas cars, hybrids, plug-in hybrids, and yes, diesels.  You've seen it before though.

For starters, where are you getting these numbers?  You just say 'electric power plants' as though they were all equally efficient.  There are cogeneration plants that are over 70% efficient, so that's simply wrong.  On top of that, electric engines are about 90% efficient.

Secondly, nuclear and renewable energy plants don't have any CO2 emissions, regardless of efficiency.

Thirdly, diesels have 15% more greenhouse gas emissions per volume than gas cars, so a 50 mpg diesel emits as much CO2 as a 43 mpg gas car (or hybrid).

Fourthly, diesels also have other emissions.  Ultra-low sulfur diesel has basically solved their high sulfur emissions problem, but they still have high particulate emissions (which cause health problems) and NOx emissions (which cause various environmental problems).

Aptera (California company making an EV and plug-in hybrid) wanted to make their plug-in with a diesel engine, but they couldn't find a small diesel engine that could pass California emissions tests because of these problems.

In short, people think EVs are better than diesels because they are.

Answer 4

Because their familiarity with electricity ends at the wall outlet.   Thus, they get an image of coming home from work and "plugging in" the car to a convenient recep next to the driveway that doesn't having a tall smokestack belching out smoke, like the local Electric Company does.

Answer 5

The main reason I like them is for local driving (under 150 miles) and the possibility that you can recharge them yourself without having to be tied to the grid.

Answer 6

Assuming you are talking about "plug in" electric cars, the type of generating plant (coal fired, natural gas fired, nuclear, hydroelectric, etc) determines the amount of pollution so that varies considerably.  Efficiency is not directly translatable into pollution either.   Items like initial cost, range, etc are really a different topic entirely.

However, having said all that, your question was: Why do so many people think electric cars are "best"?   Everybody has their own opinion why some thing is better than some other thing--based on what is important to them.  In terms of pollution generated by actually DRIVING an electric car there is a WHOLE lot less CO2 emitted than when DRIVING a diesel.  I would imagine that to most people, that is all they consider when making their choices.   They don't look at the whole energy picture the same way you did.

Answer 7

The answer to this question does not lie with the efficiency of the power production (burning diesel, burning coal, whatever).  It has more to do with the efficiency with which the electric car used that energy.

Electric motors are more efficient ways of converting potential energy to mechanical energy.  That’s one.

The biggest one comes with braking.

Imagine you are stopped at a traffic signal.  The light turns green.  You accelerate to speed (using tremendous amounts of energy compared to what it takes to keep the car moving).  Unfortunately, the next light turns red just as you get to speed.  You have to stop.  Here's what happens next:

In a gasser, you apply the brakes, which take all the kinetic energy you bought burning fuel, and dump it overboard in the form of waste heat through your brake discs.  You come to a complete stop, but your motor continues ticking over, sipping fuel (My VW diesel at least cuts out the injectors while braking in compression, but I still have to idle).

In an electric car, you apply the brakes, which cuts the motor into the charging circuit.  The act of charging the batteries puts a significant load on the motor, slowing the car down (disc brakes cut in at the last moment, fully stopping you- If you've driven a Prius you can feel it).  You get much of the energy you spent accelerating back for the next start.  While you are waiting at the light, the motor uses no energy.

You are able to convert stored energy into kinetic energy and back again.  You have losses, but since a gasser only does one direction of this cycle, you're still way, WAY ahead.

Answer 8

who cares

Answer 9

Fact one

to refine crude oil into gasoline diesel or otherwise requires emitting a large amount of CO2 emissions.

Fact two

Electric cars use energy far more efficiently even when factoring in power generation. As compared to the internal combustion engine.

Fact three

There are currently no viable options for replacing gasoline with a viable clean fuel. Ethanol is inefficient, and others are too difficult to mass produce.

Fact four

There are many viable options replacing coal generated electricity in a cost effective manner. Primarily Nuclear and Wind with Solar rapidly becoming very viable as well.

Fact five

The cost of Crude Oil is going up as supplies go down,  as good as technologies get it cannot make oil out of thin air.

----

Society moves to what is more efficient. As the price of Oil grows, and technologies make batteries charge faster and carry more electric cars will be the natural option.

One source of energy for domestic, industrial, and transportation needs.

That is efficient.

Answer 10

It all depends on where you live and what produces energy in your area.  If you live in an area that gets a good portion of electricity from wind solar and other renewables it may be worth it. People also are hoping more renewable electricity suppliers will be producing in the near future.  

With regular diesel you have to drill it ship or pipe it to a refinery then refine it and pipe it to distributors which then send it on rails and trucks to deliver it to gas stations where you then have to drive to, to pick up your fuel.  At least with power stations some of that transport can be eliminated.  It is also thought of as easier to regulate a few power stations emissions than millions of cars especially with those of us who like to take car emissions devices off and mess under the hood to get higher performance at the expense of air quality.  

Electric cars are also a lot easier to equip with solar panels and regenerative breaking devices than non electrics.

I'm not saying diesels aren't great I like them especially when run on biodiesel which is less poluting and if made from waste oil removes a waste product and turns it into a valuable rescource.  

We will probably need both technologies along with cleaner electricity generation to make things even better.

Answer 11

I may be picky but the diesel fuel needs to get to the car from the refinery; if your including the transmission cost of electricity.

You may also move the pollution to an area outside of an urban area where out lungs reside.

Don't know about those efficiency factors.

Edit:  Perhaps being as efficient is good enough since the cars will likely be charged at night when power plants are most inefficient.  In other words we would increase the efficiency of the power plant.  My answer is qualified to the extent that: I'm just a guy who fell off the turnip truck.

Edit again:  It isn't the efficiency it is the cost.  Part of the diesel comes from the middle east.  Perhaps you need to add the lives of our brave soldiers to the cost of diesel fuel.

I started this question behind you 95%, now I'm completely on the other side.  Like someone else said, "Who cares" about efficiency it is cost to our lungs, and our brave soldiers.  I guess best answer is out of the question.  By the way do you work for an oil company?

Answer 12

Simple: because people ignore the in-efficiencies and the pollution involved in actually producing the electricity!  So when you look at just the car driving  -- it does not pollute.

Now, if you just use hydroelectric, or even wind energy, to produce the electricity needed there would be less pollution generated.  

One additional factor that you are ignoring: large scale power plants centralize the pollutants, e.g, the pollutants are all produced in one place.  Therefore, if an efficient CO2 scrubber can be developed for these plants then the pollutants from electricity production  can be minimized much easier than if 1,000,000 (or more) cars are running around with internal combustion engines such as diesels.

Answer 13

I heard the best way to reduce our dependency to fossil fuel is Hybrid Diesel.  We have the Technology now, oppose to the other alternative fuel sources.   As to plug in Electric car, If used right,they can also reduce our dependency to fossil fuel and reduce pollution.    We waste electricity at night.   We can't turn off our power plants when people stop using electricity.    If we charge up at night, we prevent the lost of electricity to some degree.   I do agree with you that people are Naive on how we aquire electricity.   I get a headache listening to the Hydrogen power people.  They still think it's a new fuel source rather than a new way to store energy.