Why do the reds always lose? Bad players? Bad coaches? Bad owners?

Question

Since the ken griffey jr trade the Cincinnati Reds have found that even though Ken griffey jr was not the same guy he was in seattle he brought leadership to the team.

Since the trade the Post Griffey record Now stands at

1 win 9 lost

Wow and now in another great move by our owners we have traded the biggest power hitter on our team away as the reds have traded Adam dunn.

Wow in less than one year we trade Josh Hamilton, Ken Griffey jr, and adam dunn.

Now our best player is a 3rd basmen by the name of edwin encarnacion who cant hit his way out of a paperbag.

Im sorry every day when I think our owners have reached there peak of being the worst owners in baseball they go and do something stupid and make things worse.

Before I would trade dunn but not after trading griffey.

First thing they need to do is get rid of dusty baker and get a real manager and get a real pitching coach and a real hitting coach.

I vote for new owners in cincinnati old bobby boy aint getting it done. These guys are worse than mike brown the owner of the bengals. I never thought an owner could be worse than brown guess I was wrong.

Answer 1

Hi. I'm a huge Reds fan...since the nasty boys days with Dibble coming to my high school.

You know the Reds haven't had a good quality division win since that world series year of 1990 with Jose Rijo and company. The problem is that 1990 team got old and the GM (Jim Bowden) was a complete maverick.

At the time, Bowden didn't invest in the farm system unlike most of today's successful teams. He chose to compete via free agency and that turned out to be a bad move cas' the reds are a small payroll team.

Then there was a year 1998/1999 when the reds barely won the divison in a drama queen fashion with a bunch of newbies...but instead of investing their monetary gains in the farm system and starting pitching they chose to go get Griffey, eric milton, and build a home-run friendly ballpark. Milton was a terrible aquisition cas' he was like the worst in mlb for homeruns given up even before he came to the reds ballpark. That was a bonehead move. Instead of getting better pitchers for a descent lineup via free agency and trades they chose the holy grail of getting griffey and griffey got injured too often. Also he's never been on a wining team or helped the mariners win (plus he's a cancer to the rest of the team with his sense of entitlement)...so that was a bad move.

And the years since have been wasted cas' griffey can't be moved and then dunn couldn't be moved (since both have huge salaries and under perform routinely) and the starting pitching had been atrocious.

But we got lucky with Harang and Arroyo had that one really good year. Now we actually have a closer (btw david weathers is a wannabe hack that's still a mystery) and 4 descent starting picthers in harang, cueto, volquez, and arroyo. and the middle relievers look alright too. Yes these pitchers aren't better than the ones on the cubs and the brewers, but they are just as good as st. louis.

Now the hitting and defense is where we need the most improvement. Encarnacion has to go eventually. He's a good #3 or 4 or 5 hitter for now but he's terrible at 3b. Votto and Bruce needs a year or 2 before they are re-evaluated. Philips and Kepplinger are good. Hairston has earned a spot for next year but he's a free agent so who knows. Patterson needs to be the next one to go along with friend dusty baker.

So the reds need a catcher and some outfielders and even a 3b....as encarnacion is expandable. I don't think Arroyo should go, but he's running out of 2nd chances. This team is in a flux but that's a good thing. With free agency approaching, the reds have some money they can spend on several mid-level players and use a lot of that money to build the farm system.

So the reds are 2 to 3 years away right now but better than where they were a year or 2 ago.

Answer 2

it was bad ownership for a while, they have had some young guys come up that just havent panned out.  homer bailey still has a chance, they have a lot of prospects, but why not trade griffey and dunn and get some prospects??? did you really think the reds are going somewhere this year or next??? not very likely.  However Walt Jocketty is a genius and will turn this organization around in the next 5-6 years.  He did it with the cardinals by acquiring guys after the non-waiver wire deadline (woody williams and larry walker, both of whom flourished with us and took us to the world series.)  Encarnacion must only hit against the cardinals b/c everytime we play him he kills us.  Have hope though, you are starting to sound like a cubs fan, and god knows we dont need any more of them running around.  And i agree with you that baker is a bum, but you wouldnt be winning with a better coach, let baker fail while you are getting better, and then when the team is ready to compete, go out and get a competent head coach.

Answer 3

I feel your misery. d**k Pole (regardless that Greg Maddux said he was the greatest thing since sliced bread) is not a good pitching coach! How can a pitching coach who had a losing record and no more than 25 wins teach anyone to be great?!?! d**k Pole needs to go, first step and main reason they are horrible ! Next bring a guy in with at least 100 wins under his belt as a pitcher and at least 10 years of Major League experience (Mario Soto comes to mind as a possibility). Volquez and Cueto need someone they can relate with and d**k Pole is not the answer.  Dusty Baker is a horrible manager and really has no heart for the game. He's out to get a paycheck, period! A one-way pass out of town would be given to Homer Bailey, Paul Bako, Corey Patterson, Majewski, Todd Coffey, Josh Fogg and David Weathers. They don't belong in a minor league uniform let alone a major league uniform. We have a lot ofsalary space after the release of Dunn, Griffey and the aforementioned players!! That's all I got, I could say more but you already know!!!

Answer 4

Poor management, compounded by a seemingly not knowing how to come up with a winning team.

# 1. Pitching. Starting, relieving, and closer.

# 2. Defense. You know, guys that can pickup a batted ball and throw it to the right base and outfielders that can read the trajectory of a fly ball and have the necessary athletic ability to get to it "and" catch it.

#3. An offense that can score at least 5 runs per game.

Simple, HUH?

Answer 5

It was bound to happen. Dunn was not going to be signed after this year neither was Griffey Jr. That's why they went on and trade them for some young arms.  The rotation in the next few years will be of envy. Cueto, Volquez, Harang, Arroyo and possibly Bailey or the guy they got for Griffey.  The Reds just need to get some runs. They haven't scored in a while and like you say the guy doing the most damage is Encarnacion with a couple of HRs here and there. On both trades they god pitching which is good because man the bullpen is horrendous. Even Cordero can't finish a game without giving us fans some heartattacks.  

So I think the main cause of losing is having no reason to win. Baker is not a very emotional guy like Piniella was or even Jerry Narron. I wanted the Reds to bring back Pete MacKannin but that didn't happen. So we'll have to stick to Baker for at least next year or until he gets fired.

Answer 6

Well, the Reds aren't looking short term here.

For Hamilton, they got Volquez, who is a Cy Young candidate this year...and young.

Griffey and Dunn were both overpaid (Jr is my fav player ever, so it pains me to admit it) and were expendable. It's time for the youth movement. And if you really think E.E. is the best player,,,you're missing young players like Phillips, Bruce and Votto. Also, Harang should bounce back from injury and with Volquez, Cueto, Bailey and more on the horizon, there is reason to hope. They have a good farm system, and wanted to dump bad salaries and expiring contracts. I think they've made the right moves in the passed year,,,before that...is another story.

So I think the ownership is actually good right now, the players are good/young and ready to improve...and the coaching is...well...you get what you get with Dusty Baker. I doubt he'll be there for too many more years, but it could be worse. At least he's not burning out any arms as the people in Chicago like to rip on him for. :)

Answer 7

D.  All of the above

Answer 8

Existing ownership is more concerned about the bottom line which explains why the poor record over several years.  Their minor league teams are not developing players either so I recommend a complete overhaul from ownership general manager, and farm director.  Plus Dusty is way over rated as a manager.

Answer 9

Reds fans better get used to losing or hope all these minor leaguers they're getting for Griffey and Dunn, produce big and produce quickly. It could be some lean years coming to Cincy..........Good luck with Dusty. I watched him everyday when he was in Chicago, but he will ruin young arms. He absolutely can wreck a pitching staff and has done it at least once, if not more.