Why the obsession with hydrogen?

Question

Someone at the Detroit Auto Show is showing a Saturn SUV that they added off-the-shelf components to, to make a plug-in hybrid. It gets equivalent 150 miles per gallon! It goes 70 or 80 miles per hour! The parts were about $8500.

Answer 1

Hydrogen is the most abundant element in the universe for a start.  Separating it from the oxygen in water gives you both halves of the fuel-qxidizer equation and the only by-product from its combustion is water.

Yes, electrolysis is, at present, expensive.  Why?  Because it uses electricity that could go into the electric plug-ins all these other responders seem to favor. Big hint: It is more efficient to burn fossil fuels in an automobile engine that it is to burn them to generate electricity to power a vehicle.  The only advantage in the latter is that it moves any direct polution source to someone else's back yard.

When another environmentally friendly and cost effective method of generating electricity, such as wind power, becomes available, either choice as an alternative fuel will become more viable.  Why not a hydrogen-electric hybrid?

And why do the environmentalists who were screaming for green power now oppose wind farms?

Answer 2

Hydrogen has the potential to be an extremely environmentally friendly fuel source if we could find a way to make electrolysis work efficiently.

However, this is not going to happen in the near future, and as you point out, plug-in hybrids and fully electric vehicles are on the verge of being available and extremely environmentally friendly.

While we should certainly continue to research hydrogen cars, I agree that we should be focusing more on the environmentally friendly technologies that are already becoming available today.

Answer 3

It is the great hope, and sounds so good to be able to get power from water. It just isn't viable yet for many reasons. Maybe some day.

How can anyone support electric cars? I do not understand it. To support these without first building massive amounts of Nuclear power, Wind Power, And to some extinct Solar, you must defy the laws of Physics, Chemistry, and Economics.

The Electrical Motor is a pretty efficient machine. The problem is that the supply chain and equipment dig coal / get oil / gas, burn coal /oil / gas, boil water (Boiler), Power Generator, Generate Electricity, Transport Electricity, Convert electricity to DC, then store electricity in a battery, IS VERY INEFFICIENT. The Power plant making the Power is also polluting the earth as well. You suffer all of this and you get a car that is very expensive, has a short range, and takes time to chaarge. And all the time polluting those of us that live in the country where they put all your power plants.

Answer 4

Some of you will be pleased to know that there is an easy and economical way to convert water to hydrogen. The exciting thing about what this fellow-Aussie has put together (based on 90 yr old technology) is that this system extracts the hydrogen as it is needed....only while your vehicle is running. This eliminates the need for dangerous hydrogen storage tanks, as no hydrogen is actually stored, except in its' original form...water! The vehicles' battery charge is used for the process. Once again, only while the vehicle is in operation, so there is no depletion of the power supply. Truly ingenious, and it works a treat. Visit the link below for all the details. If you're remotely skilled with a few mechanics tools, you can fit this system yourself over the weekend, at a cost of around $200. Do yourself and the environment a favour. I can guarantee your government isn't going to do it for you!

http://ozzigold.water4gas.hop.clickbank....

Answer 5

Well hydrogen is a gas that can fuel your car as long as you can go. I mean yeah literally. Space ship use hydrogen to go to space, so it's that important. Hydrogen is the lightest element in the universe and the most abundant. Because we all have water or H2O, hydrogen is also found in Earth but bondedwith oxygen. The thing is with hydrogen, if you have an engine that takes in hydrogen, you car would probably would not need another set of fuel for at least a week or maybe days. As you can see, hydrogen has a potential to be an alternative fuel. I just hope that a person would figure out how to extract hydrogen from H2O. I know it's possible, bit i want cheaper method that is environmental friendly. glad i could help

Answer 6

How can electrical driven vehicles be more efficient than one that drives with oil or gas? When you have to create heat to make the electricity then send it to the vehicle for storage vs just burning the fuel at the point of usage in the vehicle! That's why it's less expensive to heat your home with oil or gas vs using electric heaters to do the same thing! Burn once, make the heat and use it to do the work!  Hydrogen has very little BTU's available. It's boiling point is 20 degrees above absolute zero. The lower the boiling point the less you can expect for potential energy available. If only we could harness the energy in boiling lava! The Germans have already studied the theoretical limits of the hydrogen fuel cell and they believe that only with hydrates used in large vehicle capacities such as buses or large trucks would it be feasible!

Answer 7

The obsession with hydrogen is based in its availability and potential. For now, we must find a way to trust electricity and biofuel. This is because hydrogen when compressed into a fuel cell, is still too voluminous to be used practically in an automobile.

Answer 8

People (esp. researchers) are enthusiastic about hydrogen because hydrogen is what the Bush administration and its backers have been willing to put money into.  Gotta have money if you want to do research.

As for WHY this is their favorite thing...

Hydrogen has three major features:

1.  It is most cheaply made from fossil fuels (reformed natural gas, gasified coal and oil).  It is very expensive to make from e.g. sun and wind.

2.  It lends itself to large, centralized systems (you don't want coal gasifiers in every garage).

3.  There are a lot of problems to be solved before it can become a real market player.

The Bush administration is backed by oil and coal interests, so this fits perfectly with what they want:  they'll have an advantage in the market for hydrogen, it'll take big-money investments so small companies can't compete, and the time lag means they'll get every possible penny out of their oil fields and refineries before the switch comes.

None of this is true for electricity.  Conspiracy theory, or just "follow the money"?

EDIT:  Here is the Green Car Congress post on the AFS Trinity, with better discussion than you'll get here:

http://www.greencarcongress.com/2008/01/...

Tom claims "It is more efficient to burn fossil fuels in an automobile engine that it is to burn them to generate electricity to power a vehicle."  He's dead wrong.  Gasoline engines are lucky to hit 30% efficiency, but combined-cycle gas turbines can hit 60%.  If the original fuel is coal, even old-fashioned steam powerplants are twice as good as auto engines because the coal-to-liquids process is only about 50% efficient.  Plus, the PHEV can run on wind, solar, nuclear, or hydropower.

The future of ground transportation is electric.

Answer 9

A)  good answers before me.

B)  what does your title have to do with your text?

hydrogen is the lightest energy source we know of.

(other than nuclear, but that's another story.)

and we like the byproduct of burning it.

however there isn't any readily available.

it must be made, very expensively.

Saturn SUV that gets 150 mpg?

i doubt it.

of course, if you put a couple extra batteries in it, and charged it at home, and only took short trips, and didn't count the energy used making the electricity in the first place, then you could make that false claim.

keep in mind, i spend $3000-$5000 a year on gas these days.

if there were a reasonable 150 mpg car available, i'd buy it in a heart beat.

if Saturn, or anyone, could make one, they'd make a fortune.

if you don't see it available, then it can't reasonably be made.

so, i got a bridge i'd be willing to part with.

are you interested?